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Rockman500
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:04 pm Posts: 101
Vehicle: 92 vitara
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:16 pm |
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I brought a jeep the advert told me too pulling Dana diffs out for the vitara has brand new lsd in rear wreckers wanted 300$ ea so I brought a whole car from gumtree for $500 hope to cut down arb bull bar to suit vitara weel see [url][/url]
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Gwagensteve
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:30 pm Posts: 12752 Location: Melbourne
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:37 pm |
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I guess you could put the 1UZ in the jeep. The jeep runs an AW-4 variant so you could use a combination of toyota and jeep parts to adapt the motor to the jeep auto and you'd be away.
Alternatively, how did you determine that XJ diffs are desirable? They're going to be quite a lot of work to fit to end up with diffs that really aren't much stronger than whats in the car now. That rear D35 is cheese, LSD or not. Aren't they a C clip axle?
Steve.
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vet 180
Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 11:50 am Posts: 1243
Vehicle: Vitara 1994
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:40 pm |
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Wait, you bought a XJ for it's axles? I am surprised you found one with its axles not broken yet!
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Gwagensteve
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:30 pm Posts: 12752 Location: Melbourne
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 1:48 pm |
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Oh, as a thought, you're going to heave some hokey tall gearing with those axles. Axle ratio is 3.55. Triton is circa 4.5, Vitara is 5.12. The very strong low rev torque of the jeep motor and the 2.7:1 low range of the NP231 transfer (along with tiny tyres) are what make the gearing (just) workable in an XJ, but with a manual and 2:1 low range you're going to be in a world of hurt off road.
I can't remember the ratio gaps now, but to convert to something meaningful like a 4.56 will require new diff centres if I recall correctly.
I guess the upside is you can buy all sorts of upgrade parts for XJ axles, the downside is you're likely to need them.
Also note the XJ's don't run front freewheeling hubs like the triton and vitara, so the front driveline will be turning constantly. This makes getting front driveline angles correct really critical to prevent vibration.
That front D30 is high pinion, which is good for strength (thankfully, as it's really not much bigger than a sierra diff) but that might complicate clearance around exhaust etc or push your ride height way up to make clearance.
Whats the plan for suspension? replicate the vitara bracketry on the rear Dana axle and run the Jeep 5 link in the front?
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Rockman500
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:04 pm Posts: 101
Vehicle: 92 vitara
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 2:25 pm |
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Yeah it's because u can get mountains of parts for them and the length means I don't have to chop axles-housings I don't want to modify chassis too much as engeneering wants to avoid I will strip diffs and change those brackets being solid axle won't have to change sump extractors tucked between sump bell housing to drivers side away from front shaft can change to freewheel hubs with parts from America it has 3.55 gears so can change depending on triton box gearing will set first then if needed will pop centres out after to change ratio both have 4ltr engine I know the v8 produces more but not pushing a 5 ton jeep now hahaha just my little vit so hopefully diffs will have a nice life
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tanshi
az supporter
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:30 pm Posts: 7719 Location: Brisbane
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 3:10 pm |
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you clearly don't know what a jeep weighs, ~1500kg. they are light as hell.
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vet 180
Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 11:50 am Posts: 1243
Vehicle: Vitara 1994
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 4:31 pm |
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Rockman500 wrote: Yeah it's because u can get mountains of parts for them and the length means I don't have to chop axles-housings I don't want to modify chassis too much as engeneering wants to avoid I will strip diffs and change those brackets being solid axle won't have to change sump extractors tucked between sump bell housing to drivers side away from front shaft can change to freewheel hubs with parts from America it has 3.55 gears so can change depending on triton box gearing will set first then if needed will pop centres out after to change ratio both have 4ltr engine I know the v8 produces more but not pushing a 5 ton jeep now hahaha just my little vit so hopefully diffs will have a nice life Mate it is really a bad choice. Sure there is plenty of aftermarket, but you are looking at 6k min to get each end up to spec. The vitara/triton combo and IFS will be just as strong and a lot less headache. If you want a jeep axle look at starting with a D44.
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vet 180
Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 11:50 am Posts: 1243
Vehicle: Vitara 1994
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 4:33 pm |
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tanshi wrote: you clearly don't know what a jeep weighs, ~1500kg. they are light as hell. Yeah the XJ is mega light due to the monocoque chassis
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Rockman500
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:04 pm Posts: 101
Vehicle: 92 vitara
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Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2016 4:04 pm |
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[url][/[URL=http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/wheatbelttyresockman-500/media/image_zpsoqog7i6t.jpeg.html] [/url][url][/[URL=http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/wheatbelttyresockman-500/media/image_zpskbkz71of.jpeg.html] [/url]u]]
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Rockman500
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:04 pm Posts: 101
Vehicle: 92 vitara
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Posted: Sun Jul 17, 2016 4:08 pm |
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Ok update Sierra diffs acquired now And got a 2000 jimny to take radius arms and brackets from diff housing to make it coil sprung diff a little shorter but should be ok body in watch primer and I can get down to a 75mm body lift going to remove tunnel now as it dosent do anything strengthen floor and firewall I brought a plasma cutter to make life a little Easyer
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Rockman500
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:04 pm Posts: 101
Vehicle: 92 vitara
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Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 3:31 pm |
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[udrl][/url] [url][/url[URL=http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/wheatbelttyresockman-500/media/image_zpsq1k1xqr2.jpeg.html] [/url][url][/[URL=http://s1074.photobucket.com/user/wheatbelttyresockman-500/media/image_zps7tz7voym.jpeg.html] [/url]]] plasma cutter turned up from eBay so jimny towers ready to go on vit ones removed wt diff needs stripping and housing changed for radius arms getting there
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Gwagensteve
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:30 pm Posts: 12752 Location: Melbourne
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Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 3:58 pm |
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Interesting that you arrived at Sierra as the choice of diffs to use.
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jdk81
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:30 pm Posts: 2372 Location: Ballarat, VIC
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Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 5:33 pm |
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atari4x4
az supporter
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 10:30 pm Posts: 34843 Location: East Radelayed
Vehicle: SV420+SV620 Vitara's
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Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 5:40 pm |
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Rockman500
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:04 pm Posts: 101
Vehicle: 92 vitara
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Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 5:59 pm |
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Gday Steve yeah so many weeks of research just ended up being an easy solution looked at USA websites blokes are 50/50 on use can get cromeolly axles cv s so I had to make a choice I had axles and brought 2000 jimny wreck saw a couple of build threads seemed a easy option which looks like it is going to be the car is a daily I don't intend to do jumps every weekend or competition use just beach and bush camping hope all goes to plan
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jdk81
Joined: Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:30 pm Posts: 2372 Location: Ballarat, VIC
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Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:28 pm |
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What about track width? ==> Kingpins? Vit rear diff is bigger/stronger than a sierra, it would be a downgrade on a stock engined vit, let alone this.
Why not hilux or perhaps cruiser diffs?
Jimny front radius arms are weak and bend relatively easily under jimny power/weight, let alone what you are planning.
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Gwagensteve
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:30 pm Posts: 12752 Location: Melbourne
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Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:38 pm |
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Which US websites advocated Sierra front axle with a v8 in it? That sierra axle is far too narrow and much, much too weak.
If you are referring to the calmini live axle conversion kit for the vitara which uses a Sierra housing, that's a terrible idea. Trial tough offer a Hilux axle kit (the "trail slayer) which I think has problems of its own but it has been run locally with success by members of this forum.
Jimny's are renowned for bending radius arms. your car is going to weigh more than a fully laden Jimny with much more weight on the front end. Those radius arms are not strong enough and again, consequences of a failure are very severe. I would have used Range Rover radius arms.
Please reconsider your axle and suspension choice for your own safety. Most Sierra and Jimny housings that are bent are done on beaches. If you're actually suggesting you're going to daily drive the car around other road users please build it with axles appropriate for the weight and power of the car.
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Rockman500
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:04 pm Posts: 101
Vehicle: 92 vitara
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Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:40 pm |
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As far as width at the moment looks like with jimny Spring bracket it will just fit I'm going to get new brackets laser cut I understand jimny radius are small rear vit diff staying just have to change gearing as Steve mentioned earlier in post u can put vit side gears in front run more spline axles engeneer wants to See mostly standard parts I can make heavier radius arms once been to pits as a thread on here a bloke did some tube ones wanting Toyota diffs were an option kept getting conflicting threes on which ones to use so thawt I'd keep it simple and stay with Suzuki stuff
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Rockman500
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:04 pm Posts: 101
Vehicle: 92 vitara
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Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:43 pm |
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Yeah Steve the trail slayer kit was no good for engeneering as it bolts in middle and is like a 4 link great for off-road no so much on road I would have brought one I'll look at some ranger over ones
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Gwagensteve
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:30 pm Posts: 12752 Location: Melbourne
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Posted: Tue Jul 19, 2016 6:51 pm |
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I cannot believe that any engineer will pass a a ~1400kg (dry) car with 180Kw and 400Nm on a Sierra front axle housing. It is totally beyond belief.
Yes, engineers like factory standard parts, because they have already been engineered for the application. That's not what you are doing, you're using undersized components that are already prone to failure in their factory configuration and subjecting them to more weight and force than they were ever designed for.
Even if the engineer will sign this car off, it is not going to be safe in that configuration. I genuinely don't believe you understand how unreliable and potentially dangerous this new build direction is.
Please use appropriate strength parts for the weight and power of the car.
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vet 180
Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 11:50 am Posts: 1243
Vehicle: Vitara 1994
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Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 12:49 am |
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Please do not use sierra axles!!!!!!!
They are too narrow, too weak, the rear pumpkin is in the wrong place for you application and is just generally an awful idea.
I would put patrol diffs under it before going sierra diff, even the jeep diffs are a better option.
What is wrong with the original triton idea? Seemed like the best one so far. IFS is an advantage for beach work, didn't look too hard (compared to what your currently proposing) to fit, and they looked strong enough.
I really want you to finish this.....so please do not use sierra diffs!
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VitNick
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2013 8:47 am Posts: 302
Vehicle: 92 WT Sierra
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Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 3:56 pm |
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Still trying to find the link again but this was up on gumtree/ ebay recently as an unfinished project.
Edit, just found the link but it was marked as "sold"
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Rockman500
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:04 pm Posts: 101
Vehicle: 92 vitara
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Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 10:26 pm |
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Been out mates farm creek today he has a 83 hilux there gettin diffs outa that give them a go
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vet 180
Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 11:50 am Posts: 1243
Vehicle: Vitara 1994
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Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 10:32 pm |
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Rockman500 wrote: Been out mates farm creek today he has a 83 hilux there gettin diffs outa that give them a go Much better idea. They are still narrow, but will work much better for your application.
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Gwagensteve
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:30 pm Posts: 12752 Location: Melbourne
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:14 am |
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Still too narrow but at least they are strong enough.
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vet 180
Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 11:50 am Posts: 1243
Vehicle: Vitara 1994
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 1:31 pm |
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Gwagensteve wrote: Still too narrow but at least they are strong enough. And have the pumpkins in the right place....
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Rockman500
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2015 10:04 pm Posts: 101
Vehicle: 92 vitara
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 1:56 pm |
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That's a prob as the front tail shaft is passenger side with triton transfer so I will lathe cv outers off and swivel them over so I can flip diff also sump plug was going to have to do it with Sierra ones I have a 100 series wreck so I'll get radius arms from that
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vet 180
Joined: Mon May 05, 2014 11:50 am Posts: 1243
Vehicle: Vitara 1994
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:55 pm |
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I was referring to the rear diff.
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evilmonkey
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 11:32 pm Posts: 26
Vehicle: 97 maruti ute
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Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:58 am |
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What ended up happening with this? Ever get finished?
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greenzook89
az supporter
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2009 11:30 pm Posts: 2584 Location: Ipswich
Vehicle: LJ80V-II, SJ40, SJ40T, RS415
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Posted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:39 pm |
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evilmonkey wrote: What ended up happening with this? Ever get finished? Bump for updates
_________________ 31zook wrote: Makes me want something similar
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