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| Pan-hard rod questions http://auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=51900 |
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| Author: | Qthefun [ Mon Feb 08, 2016 7:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Pan-hard rod questions |
Ok so lift looks good and feels great but how do I know if the Pan-hard rod is too short? left rear is life 3mm lower. When I was looking for a lift I noticed all of them over 40mm had adjustable pan-hard rods extended brake lines ect. My lift has turned out a little bigger than expected so should I be worried? Also how do you figure out how much longer to make it? |
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| Author: | watermouse [ Mon Feb 08, 2016 8:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
Pan-hard rods centre the axel housing under the car at rest. They don't affect height. When you lift the car the extra angle on the pan-hard rod means it is pulling the housing to one side. I forget which way it is mounted but you will notice one wheel is more inside the guard than the other. If you can live with that then no need to change it. If it bugs you that your wheels are offset sideways then look at getting an adjustable rod. I had a "50mm" lift in mine and never felt the urge to get an adjustable pan-hard rod. I did need to get extended brake lines. The originals were pulling tight at full droop. |
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| Author: | fordem [ Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
In some cases the panhard rod can affect height - they can sometimes prevent the axle from "drooping" - and increasing the length of the rod is the "cheap" fix for the problem, the correct fix is to extend one of the mounts to return the rod to a horizontal position. |
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| Author: | shep [ Tue Feb 09, 2016 5:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
fordem wrote: In some cases the panhard rod can affect height - they can sometimes prevent the axle from "drooping" - and increasing the length of the rod is the "cheap" fix for the problem, the correct fix is to extend one of the mounts to return the rod to a horizontal position. The panhard and drag link need to be on the same angle or it will bump steer badly |
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| Author: | fordem [ Tue Feb 09, 2016 8:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
shep wrote: The panhard and drag link need to be on the same angle or it will bump steer badly So make the drag link horizontal - that, by the way, is the general concept behind high steer kits. |
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| Author: | shep [ Tue Feb 09, 2016 3:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
Find a hi steer for a jimny |
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| Author: | Qthefun [ Tue Feb 09, 2016 6:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
seems to drive and steer fine so maybe I am worried about nothing? |
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| Author: | got_bar_work [ Wed Feb 10, 2016 7:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
U can move the mounts but u would need to get a drop pitman arm as well. Its not that much of a problem to go to all the effort. |
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| Author: | Sloba [ Wed Feb 10, 2016 3:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
if you've only gone a 50mm lift i wouldn't bother... |
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| Author: | shep [ Wed Feb 10, 2016 6:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
I haven't been able to find/buy a drop pitman arm. |
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| Author: | Gwagensteve [ Wed Feb 10, 2016 6:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
Moving the panhard rod mounts will also move the roll axis of the car. This will have an effect on handling. |
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| Author: | fordem [ Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
First - we're talking about lifting the vehicle here, so that in itself is going to have an effect on the handling. Let's look at it a little more closely now - and correct me if I'm wrong - we're lifting the vehicle so the CG is going to be higher - if we leave the panhard rod in it's original location, that increases the roll moment - if we now move the panhard rod mount on the axle up, this should lift the roll axis, and that theoretically reduces the roll moment as compared to where it was before the panhard rod was lifted. Surely reduced roll moment and it's effect on handling is a good thing. |
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| Author: | Qthefun [ Mon Feb 15, 2016 6:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
seems the rear has shifted to the right (if looking at the back of the Jim), the front looks to be ok and handle fine, leans a little more but that is to be expected? I have a Canadian mate who owned a samurai for years (tricked it out) and is an hydraulic engineer who can make me a drop pitman arm (will do a build thread), if it works (eg: helps with control of the car in flex and allows more of it) will let you all know  Will get an adjustable pan-hard for the rear and a steering damper. |
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| Author: | Qthefun [ Mon Feb 15, 2016 6:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
fordem wrote: First - we're talking about lifting the vehicle here, so that in itself is going to have an effect on the handling. Let's look at it a little more closely now - and correct me if I'm wrong - we're lifting the vehicle so the CG is going to be higher - if we leave the panhard rod in it's original location, that increases the roll moment - if we now move the panhard rod mount on the axle up, this should lift the roll axis, and that theoretically reduces the roll moment as compared to where it was before the panhard rod was lifted. Surely reduced roll moment and it's effect on handling is a good thing. Move the panhard rod up? at both ends? or the now lower end up? Sorry fordem I still have not much of an idea 
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| Author: | Jezza86 [ Mon Feb 15, 2016 8:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
droping the arm on the steering means you need to drop the panhard mount on the chassis to the same angle you could increase the height at the diff, and use some dodgy shit to attach the tie rod to a raised mount on the wheel to keep the same angle bottom line, if a (read ''my'')jimny with a 3"lift and 2"bodylift and 30"tyres can handle the central arnhem highway with adjustable panhard rods, and not suffer bump steer bad enough to worry about, your 40mm lift wont bother you at all as for the rear, if one end is siting high, the longer spring might be in the wrong side. but things can also take some time to settle i would do nothing and wait a few weeks. |
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| Author: | Jezza86 [ Mon Feb 15, 2016 8:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
the springs can also rotate in their seat/ cup and this will adjust the height by up to 10mm |
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| Author: | Qthefun [ Mon Feb 15, 2016 9:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
Jezza86 wrote: the springs can also rotate in their seat/ cup and this will adjust the height by up to 10mm Height is fine, rear has shifted horizontal to the right ---> by about 10-15mm, not causing any problems yet. Front looks good and feels great! Just worried about the "wobble" but maybe I won't get one  Cheers Jezza |
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| Author: | Gwagensteve [ Mon Feb 15, 2016 9:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
The wobble is related to kingpin preload, and secondarily about a billion other things which will take the car sensitive to it starting. The cause is ALWAYS kingpin bearing preload, the trigger can be any other other things that fall out of spec. Steve. |
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| Author: | SierraDan [ Tue Feb 16, 2016 3:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
3mm? Have you got a pair of heavy boots in the car? Small esky? You must be on some superbly level ground with even tyre pressures, tyre wear and some OCD with a tape to see that as an issue. |
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| Author: | Qthefun [ Wed Feb 17, 2016 4:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Pan-hard rod questions |
SierraDan wrote: 3mm? Have you got a pair of heavy boots in the car? Small esky? You must be on some superbly level ground with even tyre pressures, tyre wear and some OCD with a tape to see that as an issue. ha ha yer bit of OCD! Not seeing it as a problem just noticed it, my work bag sits on that side of the jim... |
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