[slow_dive]

Hey guys, I'm new here, I have a 2004 Jimny manual with a pretty clapped out M13 non VVT motor. The car is in great shape otherwise. I've been reading the forums and I'm pretty much set on a Liana M16 non VVT swap.

Here's the catch, the wrecker wants $990 AUD for the low KM M16. While this is ok, I think I can do better. I'm a motor mechanic by trade so the whole swap, tools, consumables, workshop space, etc etc is no issue.

My question is, Can I build an M16 using parts from junk yard stuff? My idea is getting a cheap M16 block from a swift and using a head from a non VVT M15 from a Cruze. If I can find the stuff at U-Pull-It, I can get a complete motor for 250 (assuming it needs rings/bearings)

Has anyone tried M15 head onto M16 block using M15 cams and timing cover to convert it to non VVT?
Can I use stuff from the original M13 on the M16 block instead of buying an M15 head/cams?
Are the heads the same?
Is the deck height the same across blocks?
Should I just shut up and buy a running M16 from a suzuki wrecker?

Cheers for your time.

[ZUZUKI]

Hi slow,
From the slow (as in no) response, it looks like you will be pioneering some of this stuff.
From what I gather, the M engines are fairly robust if looked after & there are lots about with not much wrong with them.
My 2c is that ringing around wreckers should get you a decent engine for less that $990.
If you are not in a particular hurry, then the right car may come up at a U-Pull-It joint.
I'm sure you know that minor differences between versions can drive you mad with what 'should' be interchangeable, but turns out not to be - the reason behind your questions.
Bound to be bits that you needs to swap / source to make it work which ever way you go.
Good luck,
Rgs, Michael

[jdk81]

Spend a day at a you pull it wreckers and pull stuff apart and test assemble to see what will work.
If it doesn't work it only costs you a day and entrance fee.

[greenzook89]

I picked up a whole Liana M16 with 170xxx on the clock for $300. Keep looking and you should find something. where are you located out of interest?

[vet 180]

Find a cheap cruise engine, throw it in and call it a day. It will still run way better than the stock clapped out M13.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[slow_dive]

greenzook89 wrote:

I picked up a whole Liana M16 with 170xxx on the clock for $300. Keep looking and you should find something. where are you located out of interest?

Cheers for the info/replies, guys. I'm in Adelaide if it makes any difference.

[slow_dive]

Found an M16A from a 2002 Liana at u-pull-it for $249, Gonna tear it apart tomorrow to see how many parts I have to throw at it to freshen it up, I'm thinking at a bare minimum it'll need a head gasket but most likely it'll need rings and bearings too. Unknown kilometers and history on this engine so it could be great, it could be scrap. Will update when I know more.

https://i.imgur.com/APmXfPt.jpg

[slow_dive]

Tore the motor apart after work today all looks very clean except for the big end bearings. Looks like it started picking up some bearing material, which is probably why it was in an unwrecked car at a wrecking yard. Crank bearings are fine, crank is fine also, bores still have the factory hone marks and the pistons, while a bit carboned up, are still in good order. So it'll require some rings and bearings, and a head gasket kit. Will most likely send the head to a head shop to get the face done and make sure the valves are sealing. Now to throw some time and effort into cleaning and measuring.

https://imgur.com/a/s58M9Ir

[slow_dive]

Nice clean block, ran a ball hone through it for a couple of seconds and I think it came up ok. Getting the head sent away to be cleaned up on Monday, now I need to find bearings and rings and some other junk like crank/rear main seals, timing chain, etc.

https://imgur.com/a/NZrkiFf

[slow_dive]

Head has been cleaned up in a hot wash, faced, pressure tested and had new valve stem seals fitted. Cams are clean, pistons are cleaned up too.

Ordered new head bolts, new genuine timing chain, some random oil seals, etc. Still looking for bearings and rings, hoping the ebay gods will provide.

After doing some research, it seems that the cylinder blocks are the same from M13, M15 and M16. They all share the same bearing sets and the same bore size with the only thing changing being the stroke. So maybe I can get a Jimny M13 head gasket set and it'll fit.

Maybe after I get this running I'll do a proper post with pics and details on what I've found and the friends I made along the way.

https://imgur.com/a/YejhxCD

[slow_dive]

Finally the rings have turned up from Japan so motor is being built in my spare time. New rings and bearings, all new gaskets, head bolts, timing chain, crank and rear main seals, etc etc. Should be finished soon, then transplanted.

https://imgur.com/a/LXiSQEZ

[bumstein]

Nice work!!

[slow_dive]

Motor is in and running, no worries. Using some 30 weight running in oil and a cheap oil filter for the first 1000km then some better quality oil and a genuine oil filter from then on. Brand new toyota pink coolant is being used because it's what I had available to me. There were really no snags along the way, nothing that held me up except for being able to find the time to actually get anything done. One major thing that could have the potential for a time waste was the cam/chain timing diagrams online were different to what both the M13 originally in the Jim and the M16 from the Liana had. I bought a genuine timing chain and it was different to the M16/15/13 factory engine manual. I believe the manual says there are 8 links in between the coloured links on the chain but the new genuine chain had 12. These marks still line up with marks on the cam sprockets but not the marks the manual says. I double checked the marks on the M13 while I was swapping over the timing covers and my set up/guess was correct. The other thing was the bolt holes for the back alternator mount bracket needed to be recessed a few millimeters to accept the dowels on the bracket. I used an M13 Multi Layer Steel head gasket set because the blocks have the same bore and deck pattern.

I reused the water pump from the old M13, reused the spark plugs and coil packs/leads because they looked ok. I had the red/brown Liana injectors cleaned and flow/spray tested and fitted them to the new engine, replacing the old light blue M13 ones. I fitted a brand new engine mount on the passenger side because it was broken in two and I had no idea until it fell apart when I was taking the engine out. Clutch was clean and nearly new so it was reused too.

All up I think it cost me a bit more than a wrecking yard motor due to all the little bits and pieces and all of the extra stuff. For example, crank and rear main seal, engine mount, injector cleaning and testing, two sets of head bolts (because I'm a dummy and bought two sets) etc etc, However now I have a brand new, fresh, zero KM engine, I know its history and am confident of it's reliability. The build was extremely simple, the construction of the M series engine is incredibly simple and straight forward, with no hidden tricks or traps. It's about as basic as a "modern" four cylinder gets and it all connects together like Lego.

Hopefully this helps someone if they can't decide to rebuild or buy a junkyard motor. Either way, if anyone has any questions, I'll be happy to answer.

Here are some pics of the engine going back in.

https://imgur.com/a/J7TkdxV

[ZUZUKI]

M16 seems to be the best bet - little bigger than a M15, but still runs ok, without the problems that people swapping M18s in to Jimnys seem to be having.
Good to hear that they are simple to work on - I've not had one in pieces yet.
Rgs, Michael