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| 6.5's gears. What else? http://auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11340 |
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| Author: | mika [ Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | 6.5's gears. What else? |
i'm looking at getting some 6.5 transfer gears for my 1990 sierra from Low Range. i plan on getting a transfer case rebuild kit, should i be getting the comlete rebuild kit or is the standard rebuild kit generally fine? Also should i be upgrading the front output shaft and is there anything else i should be getting? i plan on re-inforcing the arms and running maybe a roctoy with a custom skid or possibly just buying a mighty kong or similar. thanks |
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| Author: | Ben_Sierra [ Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:09 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
If you are going to the trouble of taking the case apart, do it properly... replace all the bearings etc then you know everything is sweet... |
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| Author: | Moph [ Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
Upgrade the output shaft while you're at it ... worth doing as the stock ones can break due to the increased torque through the 6.5's and its a pain in the butt to drop the transfer to change out a $100 part, especially if it causes damage to your gear set. I only did the gear supplement rebuild kit when I did mine and everything I reused was still schmick. That's in a transfer that had done 300,000k's already.... If your current transfer shifts sweetly and is nice and quiet then you'd probably be fine with the gear supplement rebuild kit (NOT the standard rebuild kit - you want the new output shaft needle bearing if doing a new output shaft). If you want absolute peace of mind pay the extra for the complete rebuild kit. |
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| Author: | v.w.dave [ Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:59 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
I build these things almost every weekend. The bearings/seals you get in the kit from any of those sites are of very pore quality I have now built about 10 6.5s a couple 4.6 and re-bearinged a few. You want to get the gaskets and nothing else from those online places. Spend the extra $10 or so and talk to "Weaves" on here and get good bearings and seals. Don't hold weaves to it but from memmory he can get you all the bearings and seals for around $75. I have had plenty of broek cases come accross my work bench and not once have I found one that has failed due to the output shaft. But it is only $100 so that is up to you. |
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| Author: | want33s [ Thu Apr 22, 2010 1:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
Moph wrote: Upgrade the output shaft while you're at it ... worth doing as the stock ones can break due to the increased torque through the 6.5's .
Have you ever broken a front output shaft or even ever seen someone else break one? Yes the later outputs have a longer gear surface but I've never heard of anyone breaking either sort. |
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| Author: | jimbo_jones [ Thu Apr 22, 2010 2:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
What diffs and tyre size will you be using? |
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| Author: | oozuk [ Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
v.w.dave wrote: The bearings/seals you get in the kit from any of those sites are of very pore quality
how can you say that when the bearings and seals I got from lowrange offroad with my 4.19 gears were all in genuine Suzuki packets |
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| Author: | v.w.dave [ Thu Apr 22, 2010 3:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
easy.... Get weaves to send you some bearings. And I like to support my local zookers 
But honestly if you put the two next to each other you will see the difference. Weaves seals are much softer. The ones you get in those packs or normaly hard. I can say it because I have seen it. but its JMO do what you wish. |
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| Author: | mika [ Thu Apr 22, 2010 10:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
thanks for all the replies i plan on running 33's on sierra diffs. my current transfer case seems to be good although the car has 250,000Kms |
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| Author: | mika [ Thu Apr 22, 2010 10:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
v.w.dave wrote: easy.... Get weaves to send you some bearings. And I like to support my local zookers
But honestly if you put the two next to each other you will see the difference. Weaves seals are much softer. The ones you get in those packs or normaly hard. I can say it because I have seen it. but its JMO do what you wish. what's the difference between Weaves bearings and the genuine ones supplied from low range? what brand? |
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| Author: | 11_evl [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:13 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
want33s wrote: Moph wrote: Upgrade the output shaft while you're at it ... worth doing as the stock ones can break due to the increased torque through the 6.5's . Have you ever broken a front output shaft or even ever seen someone else break one? Yes the later outputs have a longer gear surface but I've never heard of anyone breaking either sort. yep i have broken at least 2 stock ones i now have the upgraded output and have not had a problem. id get the output shaft for piece of mind... it can be replaced in the car. another thing to get would be a roctoy ring ps thats on 40" sticky compound tyres 
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| Author: | ZookiMonsta [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:20 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
11_evl wrote: want33s wrote: Moph wrote: Upgrade the output shaft while you're at it ... worth doing as the stock ones can break due to the increased torque through the 6.5's . Have you ever broken a front output shaft or even ever seen someone else break one? Yes the later outputs have a longer gear surface but I've never heard of anyone breaking either sort. yep i have broken at least 2 stock ones i now have the upgraded output and have not had a problem. id get the output shaft for piece of mind... it can be replaced in the car. another thing to get would be a roctoy ring ps thats on 40" sticky compound tyres Not your everyday mod. 
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| Author: | ajsr [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 2:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
oozuk wrote: v.w.dave wrote: The bearings/seals you get in the kit from any of those sites are of very pore quality how can you say that when the bearings and seals I got from lowrange offroad with my 4.19 gears were all in genuine Suzuki packets X2 all my bearings and seals from lowrange were genune suzi stuff, you may wnt to check you facts dave. |
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| Author: | weaves [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
Genuine suzuki doesn't mean quality. Now let me be clear here, i'm not saying suzuki bearings aren't quality, im just saying their packaging doesn't guarantee it's a top brand. As Suzuki doesn't manufacture bearings, we can safley assume its outsorced. Now take this as an example, Timken, one of the worlds biggest, most respected bearing manufacturer has moved alot of its production to China, now this company used to pride itself on its European herritage, and all its Quallity Assurance programs. Now they produce their metric tapers in China under licence to Timken Torrington Germany. Now customers are unwillingly getting chinese product as they no longer put a place of manafacture on their packaging, but from brand recognition you are assuming you are getting a top quality european product. Suzuki may be doing the same, im sure being a very large profit driven company, as are most companies, they are usually worried about profit. Not taking into consideration the metal compound quality, the service life of the bearings they are buying aslong as it outlasts the warranty period. Chances are, like most gearbox sized bearings, they are Japanese brand, and they will still be made in Japan. But you can't rule out the possibility of it being mass made under licence to Suzuki (or any other company willing to put in a big enough order) in china. The zook bearings i stock and sell are usually FAG, SKF, Nachi, Koyo, NKE. All of these i know and trust for quality. My seals are only amaando or nak, again great products that i have never had an issue with. And i benifit in no way by supplying these bearings to you guys. i am simply offering great quality product at a very good price, and also offering any of my knowledge that i can offer. i make absolutely nothing from doing this, all money goes straight to my work, the organising and shipping/deliver of stock is all done on my own time. cheers weaves |
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| Author: | v.w.dave [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
| its funny how in the end I am normaly right...Just some of you are to quick with your chatter to understand what my point is. But its ok no need to say anything:)
Thanks weaves I have had 2 "suzuki" bearings come apart as I took them out of there plastic wrap. They didnt even make it into the case. Weaves has a very good product and i will always drop his name when asked. He may or may not know this but I hhave pointed well over 30 people to him and over half of all the bearings I have used are from him. Normaly I have the people I build the cases for get them from him. Oh and thanks but I normaly do check my facts. But I love to ster shit too. If your smart enough you can normaly pic the difference in my comments. |
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| Author: | v.w.dave [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
ajsr wrote: oozuk wrote: v.w.dave wrote: The bearings/seals you get in the kit from any of those sites are of very pore quality how can you say that when the bearings and seals I got from lowrange offroad with my 4.19 gears were all in genuine Suzuki packets X2 all my bearings and seals from lowrange were genune suzi stuff, you may wnt to check you facts dave. I never said they weren't genune zook. I just said they were shit bearings and old seals that had gone hard. |
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| Author: | ajsr [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 11:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
why isnt there a wanker smiley on this forum now dave's here???? |
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| Author: | ball [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 12:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
v.w.dave wrote: :) its funny how in the end I am still full of shit...
The bearings I put in Sheps tranfer when I rebuilt it came from one of those online places you say are no good. They were all Koyo bearings. No problems with quality there. |
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| Author: | remydog05 [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
Smart you say Dave? Unfortunately Dave you just went from a position of being able to help out and provide great information (as you did) too looking like a smart arse! If you were smart you would have realized you just harmed your own reputation. You have great knowledge, be wise with the delivery. Mika there is some great info on this thread, I guess it can all depend on your budget also as Im sure we would all do something extra if we had unlimited funds. If you have the $$ sounds like a output shaft maybe well worth the money. Good luck with the 6.5's Im sure you will enjoy the driveabilty it gives you. |
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| Author: | Damo [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
Putting new bearings and seals in when you install gears almost goes without saying, however, no one has mentioned anything about replacing the idler shaft. On 99% of t-cases you pull apart you will see worn surface hardening that the needle roller bearings run on. This increases clearances between your gears which creates noise and backlash. IMO, I think it's very much advisable to replace this shaft when installing aftermarket gears. |
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| Author: | ball [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
Damo wrote: Putting new bearings and seals in when you install gears almost goes without saying, however, no one has mentioned anything about replacing the idler shaft. On 99% of t-cases you pull apart you will see worn surface hardening that the needle roller bearings run on. This increases clearances between your gears which creates noise and backlash.
IMO, I think it's very much advisable to replace this shaft when installing aftermarket gears. I must have been lucky when doing Shep's. It was in very good condition inside even after belonging to a rough bastard. 
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| Author: | Damo [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 1:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
ball wrote: Damo wrote: Putting new bearings and seals in when you install gears almost goes without saying, however, no one has mentioned anything about replacing the idler shaft. On 99% of t-cases you pull apart you will see worn surface hardening that the needle roller bearings run on. This increases clearances between your gears which creates noise and backlash. IMO, I think it's very much advisable to replace this shaft when installing aftermarket gears. I must have been lucky when doing Shep's. It was in very good condition inside even after belonging to a rough bastard. Scared into submission perhaps? 
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| Author: | mika [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 9:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
thanks guys this thread has been very helpful so at this stage i will probably get the output shaft and an idler shaft. I will also get a bearing and seal kit from Weaves that way i know there going to be good quality. do most people relace idler shaft? |
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| Author: | Ben_Sierra [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 10:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
Damo wrote: Putting new bearings and seals in when you install gears almost goes without saying, however, no one has mentioned anything about replacing the idler shaft. On 99% of t-cases you pull apart you will see worn surface hardening that the needle roller bearings run on. This increases clearances between your gears which creates noise and backlash.
IMO, I think it's very much advisable to replace this shaft when installing aftermarket gears. The gearset that I bought came with a new idler shaft as standard... |
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| Author: | mika [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 10:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
Ben_Sierra wrote: Damo wrote: Putting new bearings and seals in when you install gears almost goes without saying, however, no one has mentioned anything about replacing the idler shaft. On 99% of t-cases you pull apart you will see worn surface hardening that the needle roller bearings run on. This increases clearances between your gears which creates noise and backlash. IMO, I think it's very much advisable to replace this shaft when installing aftermarket gears. The gearset that I bought came with a new idler shaft as standard... what gears? |
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| Author: | Ben_Sierra [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 10:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
I got em from Locktup 4x4... At the time with the exhange rate it was about the same to buy from them in Perth as it was from lowrange... They were 4.16s not 6.5s though |
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| Author: | v.w.dave [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 11:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
all the good gear sets come with the idler shaft. From memmory rockhoppers do not have the shaft. The advantage of getting them from perth is the warranty replacement time if you ever have a problem. They will get the replaced in half the time. But if looked after and installed correctly you shouldn't have a problem. |
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| Author: | v.w.dave [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 11:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
ball wrote: v.w.dave wrote: :) its funny how in the end I am still full of shit... The bearings I put in Sheps tranfer when I rebuilt it came from one of those online places you say are no good. They were all Koyo bearings. No problems with quality there. first off like always you can go fuck youself. Koyo are good bearing well done good job. The last 2 kits i got from the states were no name shit in suzuki packaging. They will sell you what ever they can get the cheapest and thats what they are doing now. When you did that case you were lucky to get good bearings. They are cutting costs like every one else. |
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| Author: | mika [ Fri Apr 23, 2010 11:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
v.w.dave wrote: I build these things almost every weekend. The bearings/seals you get in the kit from any of those sites are of very pore quality I have now built about 10 6.5s a couple 4.6 and re-bearinged a few. You want to get the gaskets and nothing else from those online places. Spend the extra $10 or so and talk to "Weaves" on here and get good bearings and seals.
Don't hold weaves to it but from memmory he can get you all the bearings and seals for around $75. I have had plenty of broek cases come accross my work bench and not once have I found one that has failed due to the output shaft. But it is only $100 so that is up to you. in the kit from Weaves what bearings and seals are included, is it every bearing and seal in the transfer case? |
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| Author: | ball [ Sat Apr 24, 2010 12:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 6.5's gears. What else? |
v.w.dave wrote: first off like always you can go fuck youself. awwww, did I hurt your feelings again 
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