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Starter Motor headache
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Author:  8ONES [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:51 am ]
Post subject:  Starter Motor headache
Hey Gurus!

I'm really scratching my head here. I am in the process of installing a new engine in my Sierra. The engine is ready to go but I've hit a problem.

Now when I turn the ignition on the dash lights turn on but when you turn the key to crank the engine there is a click and then nothing (dash lights go out). To get the dash lights to work again I have to disconnect the battery and re-connect it.

The starter is connected to the positive side of the battery from the terminal closest to the drivers side. The side closest to the passenger side is connected to the negative side of the battery and there is a spade connector sourced from the alternator harness.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Bones
Author:  ridzilla [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 11:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
I had this once, but it wasnt a starter motor prob for me.... all it was, was the battery shorting on the bonnet
Author:  Bucket [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
Check your battery terminals are nice and tight and earthed properly.

I occasionally have the same problem (go to turn over, lights go out)....it always came down to loose terminals.
Author:  ridzilla [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
Bucket wrote:
Check your battery terminals are nice and tight and earthed properly.

I occasionally have the same problem (go to turn over, lights go out)....it always came down to loose terminals.


X2, my terminal clamps are rooted and always jump around
Author:  sogone [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 12:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
Nah your all wrong. The solenoid on the passenger side should not be connected at all. You should have a earth going
From the engine block that is all. So power should be too the battery side of the starter and then you should have the trigger wire to the spade fitting on the starter. No negatives at all.
Author:  Bucket [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 1:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
Anyway...do as I said and start by checking your terminals are nice and tight. It's generally simple shit like that. I know it's fixed my problem a few times when I've gone to turn her over and the clamps had loosened off.
Author:  MacDaddy [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 4:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
Sounds like a bad Neagtive wire to the chassis/engine to me, when you turn the key, everything is trying to find an earth, and cant...
Author:  Scrawny [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 7:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
sogone wrote:
Nah your all wrong. The solenoid on the passenger side should not be connected at all. You should have a earth going
From the engine block that is all. So power should be too the battery side of the starter and then you should have the trigger wire to the spade fitting on the starter. No negatives at all.


THIS!!! Ignore the loose terminal BS :roll: The earth cable mounts on the bellhousing bolts, not the back of the starter

You are causing a dead short like this
Author:  royce [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 7:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
OH FOR FUCK SAKE!!!!!

Everybody that started dribbling on about bad earths and so on that failed to notice where the earth cable HAS BEEN CONNECTED TO THE SOLENOID OUTPUT, give yourself a week holiday and dont post in tech anymore

like sogone said, you need to bolt the fat earth lead to the block, one of the bolts that holds the starter on are good for this

Also make sure the thinner earth between the firewall and dissy housing is there and working as well, they often melt and fall off

also make sure your spade connector is a black/yellow wire
Author:  8ONES [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 9:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
Wow ok guys,

To provide some further information, I reversed the two large cables on the back of the starter and it started running. So in this instance +bat to engine block side and -bat to non-block side. Having said that it was running without the key in the ignition.

If I have read all your posts above correctly, there should be no harm in checking terminals to ensure a good earthing/ground. Then the +side of the battery should go to the non-block side of the starter. The terminal closest to the block should have no connection (or should it be connected to the bellhousing? Or grouding point). Lastly the spade connector should be connected, ensuring it is indeed black/yellow.

Thanks all for you input,

Cheers, Bones
Author:  steak_knife [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 9:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
royce wrote:
OH FOR FUCK SAKE!!!!!

Everybody that started dribbling on about bad earths and so on that failed to notice where the earth cable HAS BEEN CONNECTED TO THE SOLENOID OUTPUT, give yourself a week holiday and dont post in tech anymore

like sogone said, you need to bolt the fat earth lead to the block, one of the bolts that holds the starter on are good for this

Also make sure the thinner earth between the firewall and dissy housing is there and working as well, they often melt and fall off

also make sure your spade connector is a black/yellow wire



Armsup dummy spit!!!!!!! :lol:


bout time.... :roll:
Author:  sogone [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
pompoms pompoms Week holidays for everyone! pompoms pompoms
Author:  Scrawny [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
8ONES wrote:
Wow ok guys,

To provide some further information, I reversed the two large cables on the back of the starter and it started running. So in this instance +bat to engine block side and -bat to non-block side. Having said that it was running without the key in the ignition.


The earth cable from the battery shouldn't be anywhere near the back of the starter. It goes on one of the starter mounting bolts on the bellhousing.
Author:  steak_knife [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
Scrawn wrote:
8ONES wrote:
Wow ok guys,

To provide some further information, I reversed the two large cables on the back of the starter and it started running. So in this instance +bat to engine block side and -bat to non-block side. Having said that it was running without the key in the ignition.


The earth cable from the battery shouldn't be anywhere near the back of the starter. It goes on one of the starter mounting bolts on the bellhousing.


I think we need a dummy spit for people who don't listen too!!!!!!
Author:  Scrawny [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 11:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
steak_knife wrote:
I think we need a dummy spit for people who don't listen too!!!!!!


I'll leave that for Royce :lol:
Author:  steak_knife [ Sat Nov 12, 2011 11:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
Scrawn wrote:
steak_knife wrote:
I think we need a dummy spit for people who don't listen too!!!!!!


I'll leave that for Royce :lol:


He's good at it....... :P :helloo:
Author:  youda [ Sun Nov 13, 2011 2:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
Bucket wrote:
Anyway...do as I said and start by checking your terminals are nice and tight. It's generally simple shit like that. I know it's fixed my problem a few times when I've gone to turn her over and the clamps had loosened off.


comon guys this is a very legit method of fault finding. he is just looking for the easier fixes first and it was the first thing that came to my mind as well as i have seen it so many times.
better this than replacing a starter or battery and finding its not the problem. (just because its happened to you before dosent mean its the same problem this time). luckily it was found and easily resolved.
Author:  Scrawny [ Sun Nov 13, 2011 2:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
youda wrote:
comon guys this is a very legit method of fault finding. he is just looking for the easier fixes first and it was the first thing that came to my mind as well as i have seen it so many times.
better this than replacing a starter or battery and finding its not the problem. (just because its happened to you before dosent mean its the same problem this time). luckily it was found and easily resolved.


Did you not read the original post properly??? He stuck the earth cable on the output of the solenoid. When he turned the key it caused a dead short which stuck the contacts together. This is why he had to disconnect the battery to get the contacts to let go and get dash lights back. This had NOTHING to do with loose battery terminals or earths.
I'm all for checking the basics first but in this instance the problem was overlooked and an emphasis put on something entirely different
Author:  MacDaddy [ Sun Nov 13, 2011 2:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
royce wrote:
OH FOR FUCK SAKE!!!!!

Everybody that started dribbling on about bad earths and so on that failed to notice where the earth cable HAS BEEN CONNECTED TO THE SOLENOID OUTPUT, give yourself a week holiday and dont post in tech anymore


Sorry Boss... :(
Author:  Scrawny [ Sun Nov 13, 2011 6:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Starter Motor headache
Did you get this sorted Bones?
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