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Post Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2016 7:31 pm 
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If it is a apple phone the wireless readers with engine link app is best

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Post Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 2:15 pm 
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DC3PTIKON wrote:
atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
vet 180 wrote:
I don't have any issues with the trans lock feels good as apposed to the kia sportage I drove recently that would just drive me nuts as it always felt unlocked on the highway


Yeah no use jumping the gun until temps are verified.


I'll bet my left nut that it's running hot... no temp gauge required. :wink:


Yeah agreed, but I'm a numbers Man and like to know what I'm working with! No guessing or hunches around here.


Gwagensteve wrote:
I have seen 105C on a jimny auto on a cool night at highway speeds with a 10"X10" PWR stacked plate cooler front and centre.


:roll:

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Post Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 2:48 pm 
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atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
vet 180 wrote:
I don't have any issues with the trans lock feels good as apposed to the kia sportage I drove recently that would just drive me nuts as it always felt unlocked on the highway


Yeah no use jumping the gun until temps are verified.


I'll bet my left nut that it's running hot... no temp gauge required. :wink:


Yeah agreed, but I'm a numbers Man and like to know what I'm working with! No guessing or hunches around here.


Gwagensteve wrote:
I have seen 105C on a jimny auto on a cool night at highway speeds with a 10"X10" PWR stacked plate cooler front and centre.


:roll:


And you're telling me that he didnt require a temp gauge to get that exact number, amazing........... :roll:
I'll bet my left nut that he did!

Also different Jimny's Mate, so Vet checking his own temps wouldn't be a such a bad idea as there are so many variables.

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Post Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 2:58 pm 
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DC3PTIKON wrote:
atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
vet 180 wrote:
I don't have any issues with the trans lock feels good as apposed to the kia sportage I drove recently that would just drive me nuts as it always felt unlocked on the highway


Yeah no use jumping the gun until temps are verified.


I'll bet my left nut that it's running hot... no temp gauge required. :wink:


Yeah agreed, but I'm a numbers Man and like to know what I'm working with! No guessing or hunches around here.


Gwagensteve wrote:
I have seen 105C on a jimny auto on a cool night at highway speeds with a 10"X10" PWR stacked plate cooler front and centre.


:roll:


And you're telling me that he didnt require a temp gauge to get that exact number, amazing........... :roll:
I'll bet my left nut that he did!

Also different Jimny's Mate, so Vet checking his own temps wouldn't be a such a bad idea as there are so many variables.



If a jimny on a cold melbourne night is running at 105c with an external PWR cooler, I guarantee that Vet's is running hot at 140kph on a 45c day... no gauge required.

I have a trans temp gauge & I know how much my trans temp moves around & that's running the intank cooler & an external PWR cooler. :wink:

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Post Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 3:09 pm 
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atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
vet 180 wrote:
I don't have any issues with the trans lock feels good as apposed to the kia sportage I drove recently that would just drive me nuts as it always felt unlocked on the highway


Yeah no use jumping the gun until temps are verified.


I'll bet my left nut that it's running hot... no temp gauge required. :wink:


Yeah agreed, but I'm a numbers Man and like to know what I'm working with! No guessing or hunches around here.


Gwagensteve wrote:
I have seen 105C on a jimny auto on a cool night at highway speeds with a 10"X10" PWR stacked plate cooler front and centre.


:roll:


And you're telling me that he didnt require a temp gauge to get that exact number, amazing........... :roll:
I'll bet my left nut that he did!

Also different Jimny's Mate, so Vet checking his own temps wouldn't be a such a bad idea as there are so many variables.



If a jimny on a cold melbourne night is running at 105c with an external PWR cooler, I guarantee that Vet's is running hot at 140kph on a 45c day... no gauge required.

I have a trans temp gauge & I know how much my trans temp moves around & that's running the intank cooler & an external PWR cooler. :wink:


Ah, so you have a gauge. Why not just use that nut? :lol:

So would you recommend not checking temps before doing any work? For myself that I would like to know the control temp, so when I make changes I can gauge the effectiveness of the changes and if it needs further attention, or if the fix is ample. Each to their own.

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Post Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 3:16 pm 
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The FSM will have the operating temp's.

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Post Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 5:09 pm 
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I don't know why I've done this as I'm not a big fan of autos, but any way here goes....

I just skimmed through the 215 pages of the automatic transmission section in the FSM.

The normal operating temps for Jimny auto transmissions are 70-80 degrees C.
You may have troubles shifting with oil temps less then 20 degrees C (my basic understanding is that this has more to do with resistance in the electrical circuits as the consistency of the oil).

The only mention of high temps is if there is an issue with the 'torque clutch converter circuit', in which case;
• Lock-up function is inhibited to operate.
• Upshifting to 4th gear is inhibited when A/T fluid temperature is more than 150 °C (302 °F).
• Vehicle speed is slower than 15 km/h (9 mile/h), gear position is fixed in 1st gear for prevention of engine stall.


Other then that your on your own mate.



Oh, I did find this chart that you auto fans might find interesting.

Image



And this quick skim of the trouble shooting section in the FSM has pretty much confirmed my thoughts on using autos off road. There is 92 pages of trouble shooting for an automatic, 92 pages!!!!!!
They're ok if you're within tow truck distance, but if they die in the middle of no where and your not and trained technician - you're pretty much f.....ked!

Good luck with it. :wink:

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Post Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 5:26 pm 
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atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
atari4x4 wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
vet 180 wrote:
I don't have any issues with the trans lock feels good as apposed to the kia sportage I drove recently that would just drive me nuts as it always felt unlocked on the highway


Yeah no use jumping the gun until temps are verified.


I'll bet my left nut that it's running hot... no temp gauge required. :wink:


Yeah agreed, but I'm a numbers Man and like to know what I'm working with! No guessing or hunches around here.


Gwagensteve wrote:
I have seen 105C on a jimny auto on a cool night at highway speeds with a 10"X10" PWR stacked plate cooler front and centre.


:roll:


And you're telling me that he didnt require a temp gauge to get that exact number, amazing........... :roll:
I'll bet my left nut that he did!

Also different Jimny's Mate, so Vet checking his own temps wouldn't be a such a bad idea as there are so many variables.



If a jimny on a cold melbourne night is running at 105c with an external PWR cooler, I guarantee that Vet's is running hot at 140kph on a 45c day... no gauge required.

I have a trans temp gauge & I know how much my trans temp moves around & that's running the intank cooler & an external PWR cooler. :wink:


100% agree I need a gauge to monitor my own temps. What old mate in Melbourne does is irrelevant imo. He didn't have stock aerodynamics so for all we know he could have had twice, 3x or 10x the air resistance. I am also going to defend suzuki and say that I severely doubt they wouldn't have designed a car that cant not maintain highway speeds in a stock designed car. And I will go one step further and say the Jimny is known to be extremely reliable in these parts and everyone is subject to the same conditions.

In all fairness we don't know anything about the 105deg car in question, its aerodynamics, its engine or even the efficiency of the transcooling system he designed (we only know it doesn't work well so have blamed the jimny auto trans when it could well be a poorly designed system that is more inefficient than the stock rad heater/cooler).

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Post Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 5:35 pm 
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pete_79 wrote:
I don't know why I've done this as I'm not a big fan of autos, but any way here goes....

I just skimmed through the 215 pages of the automatic transmission section in the FSM.

The normal operating temps for Jimny auto transmissions are 70-80 degrees C.
You may have troubles shifting with oil temps less then 20 degrees C (my basic understanding is that this has more to do with resistance in the electrical circuits as the consistency of the oil).


And this quick skim of the trouble shooting section in the FSM has pretty much confirmed my thoughts on using autos off road. There is 92 pages of trouble shooting for an automatic, 92 pages!!!!!!
They're ok if you're within tow truck distance, but if they die in the middle of no where and your not and trained technician - you're pretty much f.....ked!

Good luck with it. :wink:


Great info mate!

The chart is interesting as I also notice it takes a lot of accelerator* to make the TC unlock and that chart confirms the operation is normal.

*Accelerator pedal travel does not necessarily mean forward motion

I also noticed first gear is quite long and I notice this in daily operation. I wish the jim had a 6 speed. 1 would become second, a gear before 1st and a gear between 3 and 4th.

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Post Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:13 pm 
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vet 180 wrote:
100% agree I need a gauge to monitor my own temps. What old mate in Melbourne does is irrelevant imo. He didn't have stock aerodynamics so for all we know he could have had twice, 3x or 10x the air resistance. I am also going to defend suzuki and say that I severely doubt they wouldn't have designed a car that cant not maintain highway speeds in a stock designed car. And I will go one step further and say the Jimny is known to be extremely reliable in these parts and everyone is subject to the same conditions.

In all fairness we don't know anything about the 105deg car in question, its aerodynamics, its engine or even the efficiency of the transcooling system he designed (we only know it doesn't work well so have blamed the jimny auto trans when it could well be a poorly designed system that is more inefficient than the stock rad heater/cooler).


OK, Old mate here could take offence to your tone considering I'm the only person that has provided any actual data of of any sort on this issue, but I won't, I'll stick to the facts. Interestingly, nobody with an auto Jimny has contributed any actual data on temps. Perhaps they're similarly trusting that suzuki hasn't underengineerd their gearbox in this application.

The car in question is a SJ70 sierra. Engine is a completely standard G13BB. On the night in question is was running stock 205/70 tyres and stock WT gearing which put highway revs at around 3550rpm @ 100km/h. The car runs a 2" body lift and spring lift so yes, aerodynamic load is higher than a jimny, but weight is significantly lower - the car was completely empty, no rear seats, no payload, driver only.

As mentioned, the car runs a 10"X10" PWR stacked plate cooler. It is closely coupled to the radiator and receives plenty of airflow. This cooler is larger than is commonly fitted to any vehicle and is recommended for extreme conditions. One would imagine it's adequate for a 1000kg car with 80hp. My AW-4 car which is about 400kg heavier, runs a cooler 1/2 the size in still air unless the thermos are running and runs nowhere near as hot, so lets assume I know what cooling should be adequate for the size and weight of the car, so when I said, from experience, that Jimny autos run hot, it was actually from experience this isn't dependent on whether they are in a Jimny or not, or whether they are running the trans heater or not - they run hotter than other autos under the same conditions. Feel free to discount my actual, real world experience as irrelevant though.

Fan is the stock Jimny viscous fan in the Sierra shroud. Engine temperature was normal and stable. Ambient temperature was around 17 degrees from memory. Temperature was stable at around 70-80˚C on flat ground with the converter locked, but on a long, steady climb and the transmission in 3rd gear/unlocked and raid speed around 80 km/h, temperature quickly climbed to the 105˚C figure stated earlier.

Here is a (bad) photo of the cooler in the car - the top row of the cooler is visible above the suzuki badge. I don't have all the build photos of the car with me at the moment. The owner has subsequently added a second 10"X10" PWR cooler with a thermo fan on a manual switch, in an insulated area of the engine bay. The car has not done significant off road work since the extra cooler was fitted, but anecdotally, temps are lower. I drove the car in question (It's not mine) for 15 minutes or so today on road tyres and trans temp didn't exceed about 50˚C, but under the circumstances I wouldn't have expected it to.

Image

here is the link to the cooler.

https://www.pwr.com.au/portfolio/external-plate-fin
I lied, it's actually 200X280mm

You can defend Suzuki all you like, but perhaps it's better to do that with some actual data rather than trust they got it right, because Suzuki have been known to underengineer things from time to time. Local experience is that Jimmy's are not terribly reliable when used offroad and the automatic gearboxes DO fail. They are difficult to find in the trade because they get snapped up from wrecks quickly.

Make sure you post some actual temps when you're monitoring them with your app. It's fascinating this thread has gone from asking how often to change trans fluid to effectively attempting to whitewash the only real data in this thread because it's not to your liking and wave the flag for how great suzuki is. Oh well. good luck with it.

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Post Posted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 12:49 am 
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Gwagensteve wrote:
vet 180 wrote:
100% agree I need a gauge to monitor my own temps. What old mate in Melbourne does is irrelevant imo. He didn't have stock aerodynamics so for all we know he could have had twice, 3x or 10x the air resistance. I am also going to defend suzuki and say that I severely doubt they wouldn't have designed a car that cant not maintain highway speeds in a stock designed car. And I will go one step further and say the Jimny is known to be extremely reliable in these parts and everyone is subject to the same conditions.

In all fairness we don't know anything about the 105deg car in question, its aerodynamics, its engine or even the efficiency of the transcooling system he designed (we only know it doesn't work well so have blamed the jimny auto trans when it could well be a poorly designed system that is more inefficient than the stock rad heater/cooler).


OK, Old mate here could take offence to your tone considering I'm the only person that has provided any actual data of of any sort on this issue, but I won't, I'll stick to the facts. Interestingly, nobody with an auto Jimny has contributed any actual data on temps. Perhaps they're similarly trusting that suzuki hasn't underengineerd their gearbox in this application.

The car in question is a SJ70 sierra. Engine is a completely standard G13BB. On the night in question is was running stock 205/70 tyres and stock WT gearing which put highway revs at around 3550rpm @ 100km/h. The car runs a 2" body lift and spring lift so yes, aerodynamic load is higher than a jimny, but weight is significantly lower - the car was completely empty, no rear seats, no payload, driver only.

As mentioned, the car runs a 10"X10" PWR stacked plate cooler. It is closely coupled to the radiator and receives plenty of airflow. This cooler is larger than is commonly fitted to any vehicle and is recommended for extreme conditions. One would imagine it's adequate for a 1000kg car with 80hp. My AW-4 car which is about 400kg heavier, runs a cooler 1/2 the size in still air unless the thermos are running and runs nowhere near as hot, so lets assume I know what cooling should be adequate for the size and weight of the car, so when I said, from experience, that Jimny autos run hot, it was actually from experience this isn't dependent on whether they are in a Jimny or not, or whether they are running the trans heater or not - they run hotter than other autos under the same conditions. Feel free to discount my actual, real world experience as irrelevant though.

Fan is the stock Jimny viscous fan in the Sierra shroud. Engine temperature was normal and stable. Ambient temperature was around 17 degrees from memory. Temperature was stable at around 70-80˚C on flat ground with the converter locked, but on a long, steady climb and the transmission in 3rd gear/unlocked and raid speed around 80 km/h, temperature quickly climbed to the 105˚C figure stated earlier.

Here is a (bad) photo of the cooler in the car - the top row of the cooler is visible above the suzuki badge. I don't have all the build photos of the car with me at the moment. The owner has subsequently added a second 10"X10" PWR cooler with a thermo fan on a manual switch, in an insulated area of the engine bay. The car has not done significant off road work since the extra cooler was fitted, but anecdotally, temps are lower. I drove the car in question (It's not mine) for 15 minutes or so today on road tyres and trans temp didn't exceed about 50˚C, but under the circumstances I wouldn't have expected it to.

Image

here is the link to the cooler.

https://www.pwr.com.au/portfolio/external-plate-fin
I lied, it's actually 200X280mm

You can defend Suzuki all you like, but perhaps it's better to do that with some actual data rather than trust they got it right, because Suzuki have been known to underengineer things from time to time. Local experience is that Jimmy's are not terribly reliable when used offroad and the automatic gearboxes DO fail. They are difficult to find in the trade because they get snapped up from wrecks quickly.

Make sure you post some actual temps when you're monitoring them with your app. It's fascinating this thread has gone from asking how often to change trans fluid to effectively attempting to whitewash the only real data in this thread because it's not to your liking and wave the flag for how great suzuki is. Oh well. good luck with it.


Ok first of all I will mention my post was never intended to be offensive in anyway and I honestly to appreciate your input. In fact it has been your comments in various threads about jimny autos that caused me to start this thread. So thank you for taking the time to contribute to it.

With that said my comments are not defending suzuki out of some deluded brand loyalty! I really give no cares what the badge says. I was meaning to imply that there is no way ANY car manufacturer (specifically suzuki in this case) would release a transmission in a car after 18years of production that can not maintain highway speed in stock condition without cooking the trans no matter how under engineered it is. Simple as that. Warranty and recalls would cost them far more than it's worth and it would be all over the press like the current VAG situation. Therefore it makes your friends modified and transmission converted car irrelevant when comparing to a stock factory designed car. It does however become very relevant when planing to modify the car outside of the factory specifications. Yes, you have proved that under the same conditions the AW4 will run cooler than the jimny transmission, but that is it.

Just because your friends car hit 105* doesn't mean a stock jimny running at suzuki's designed specifications can not maintain highway speed or will be running hotter than the 105* indicated by your example. There are just too many variables. I drove around a rb26 powered 350z for a while. It was not possible to maintain highway speed without the water temp gauge rising to 120deg. The car ran a very expensive brand name radiator, very expensive brand name oil cooler, but couldn't drive on the highway for more that 5 mins at a time. Does that mean all RB26's run hot? No, it means that the engine was far too long for that engine bay causing a wall of engine where the air needed to flow making that very expensive brand name radiator useless as it was sitting in dead air. At the time of posting I had no idea what your mates set-up consisted or if a similar situation could have accorded. For all I know that car could have been low on ATF, could have had a faulty lock up, could have had a blocked cooler many many variables. A sample size of 1 is not enough to form an opinion, but it is enough to take the words under advisement which is what I will do.

It just means that your original recommendation is correct. I will need to get a gauge and monitor the temps to see for myself. There are a few members on here that when they post their options I will take under advisement and add a bit more credibility to and yourself and Atari are both one of those members so I can honestly say my post had no malice or intended offence behind it (tone can be hard to read on the internet). The information is appreciated and very relevant to the thread. Cheers

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Post Posted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 7:32 am 
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Noted.

I never claimed That Suzuki are selling a car that can't maintain highway speed without cooking the transmission, but prolonged 140km/h and 45deg C would well and truly be pushing the envelope for the engineering parameters of the car. Pull off the highway and then into soft sand in h4 with the the trans in 3rd unlocked and temps are only going to go one way. I do not believe the Jimny is engineered for off highway use in any meaningful way.

The just-superseded hilux suffers from excessive transmission temperatures in sand and when towing at highway speed.

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Post Posted: Sat Jan 16, 2016 6:01 pm 
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Ok I love the passion that everyone has about this topic!
question 1: is there some sort of oil filler plug on top of the trans? and if so can/could a second one be modified so as to accommodate a temp sensor so it can be removed before servicing and then replaced?
2: can the trans be cooled via another method eg: computer cpu cooling (something I have a bit of experience with) can be done without liquid cooling so would more "fins" help?
3: from a pure usage point of view autos are far stronger (used in drag cars so they don't brake) so should be good for these types of driving?
4: would a better type of oil help?

Once again vet sorry for jumping in but as we are in the same basket I hope you don't mind :)

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Post Posted: Sat Jan 16, 2016 11:35 pm 
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1 - Most automatics are filled via a tube, extending up into the engine bay - inserting a sensor down this tube is theoretically possible - it would have to be attached to the dipstick and have relatively long thin wires, making for a delicate, fragile contraption - so theoretically possible, but I don't think practical - it would also provide the temperature of the oil in the pan, and that does not seem to be where the "gurus" in this discussion think it should be measured - they apparently prefer to measure the temp where the fluid leaves the transmission - which of the two is better is a debate which I will avoid for now.

2 - as far as I know there's only one way to cool a computer CPU - attach a heat exchanger to it - whether it be an CPU-to-air heat exchanger or a CPU-to-liquid heat exchanger is immaterial at this point, you have to physically attach it to the CPU - liquid cooling is more complex especially because you will eventually "dump" the heat to the atmosphere using a liquid-to-air heat exchanger, the sole advantage is that this exchanger can be mounted physically outside the computer reducing internal temps.

There is no direct parallel in an automatic transmission - you're "churning" the fluid in the (unlocked) torque converter, heating the fluid directly, you're already pumping hot fluid out of the transmission and passing it through a heat exchanger, be it transmission-fluid-to-coolant, or transmission-fluid-to-air - yes, you can add more fins, which is the equivalent of adding an external cooler, but that takes us back to the point that any changes will probably void your warranty.

3 - this suggestion is ludicrous - an automatic transmission built for a drag car is built to take the punishment, put a regular street transmission in that drag car and watch it break first time off the line - automatics have their advantages, but they are not inherently stronger, in fact if you were to physically examine the two you would discover that the planetary gears in an automatic are much smaller than the gears in a manual. You can destroy either transmission by abusing them.

4 - theoretically yes - automatic transmission life is very closely tied to fluid life - the hotter it runs, the shorter the life of the fluid, and the shorter the life of the transmission, synthetic fluids should last longer, but once the fluid starts to overheat & break down then it needs to be changed, monitoring operational temps and providing additional cooling when necessary is key to longevity.

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Post Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 12:07 am 
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Hallelujah, measuring the temps in the pan. Glad you agree! When carrying checks as per technical service bulletin checks and all the courses I have completed, that is where we take our readings from for diagnosis, or to forward onto the manufacturer for analysis. No wonder the 'Gurus' readings are so high and would never be within spec. If the pan wasnt a good place to take reading, why manufacturers put the transmission temperature sensor in there. Hmmmmm! Maybe it's like the radiator cooler scenario. Silly manufacturers.......... :lol:

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Post Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 12:23 am 
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Qthefun wrote:
Ok I love the passion that everyone has about this topic!
question 1: is there some sort of oil filler plug on top of the trans? and if so can/could a second one be modified so as to accommodate a temp sensor so it can be removed before servicing and then replaced?
2: can the trans be cooled via another method eg: computer cpu cooling (something I have a bit of experience with) can be done without liquid cooling so would more "fins" help?
3: from a pure usage point of view autos are far stronger (used in drag cars so they don't brake) so should be good for these types of driving?
4: would a better type of oil help?

Once again vet sorry for jumping in but as we are in the same basket I hope you don't mind :)

Don't br sorry mate, your more than welcome to post in any of my topics.

1. I am going to try and read via OBD 2 port, it will be the neatest, most reversible and most accurate method. I have bought the dongle just waiting for it to arrive. I wish I had it on the weekend as I pushed the car pretty hard! 4 hours through soft sand and big dunes. many breakages but the jim survived, but did pop a tyre off the bead and I was running higher pressure than usual at 12psi.

2. No idea, typical trans cooler is what I will go.

3. Not ture. Drag cars run Automatics for times not strength.

4. No idea, but I will be running genuine suzuki oil. More oil helps as it takes longer to heat more oil, but that will depend on where you measure.

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Post Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:26 am 
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DC3PTIKON wrote:
Hallelujah, measuring the temps in the pan. Glad you agree! When carrying checks as per technical service bulletin checks and all the courses I have completed, that is where we take our readings from for diagnosis, or to forward onto the manufacturer for analysis. No wonder the 'Gurus' readings are so high and would never be within spec. If the pan wasnt a good place to take reading, why manufacturers put the transmission temperature sensor in there. Hmmmmm! Maybe it's like the radiator cooler scenario. Silly manufacturers.......... :lol:


If that's directed at me, I'm not sure that I agree, and I don't see that it would make much difference if I did, I'm no expert - I've heard the arguments to measure it in the pan, at the transmission outlet, and at both the cooler inlet & outlet - as I said I don't plan to engage in the debate.

What I will say is this - the one 4WD (not a Suzuki) I have with an automatic transmission does have a temp sensor, and that sensor is NOT in the pan, it is located at the outlet to the cooler. The TCU monitors fluid temp and flashes an overheat warning on the dash if it exceeds a preset temperature, which is documented somewhere in the manual, based on the troubleshooting section of the manual, it would also seem that the TCU varies the shift points based on fluid temperature.

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Post Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 6:56 am 
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The Jimny temp sensor is in the pan, rear right hand corner if I recall the assembly drawings correctly.

So your OBD dongle should be accurate mate.

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Post Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 11:07 am 
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fordem wrote:
DC3PTIKON wrote:
Hallelujah, measuring the temps in the pan. Glad you agree! When carrying checks as per technical service bulletin checks and all the courses I have completed, that is where we take our readings from for diagnosis, or to forward onto the manufacturer for analysis. No wonder the 'Gurus' readings are so high and would never be within spec. If the pan wasnt a good place to take reading, why manufacturers put the transmission temperature sensor in there. Hmmmmm! Maybe it's like the radiator cooler scenario. Silly manufacturers.......... :lol:


If that's directed at me, I'm not sure that I agree, and I don't see that it would make much difference if I did, I'm no expert - I've heard the arguments to measure it in the pan, at the transmission outlet, and at both the cooler inlet & outlet - as I said I don't plan to engage in the debate.

What I will say is this - the one 4WD (not a Suzuki) I have with an automatic transmission does have a temp sensor, and that sensor is NOT in the pan, it is located at the outlet to the cooler. The TCU monitors fluid temp and flashes an overheat warning on the dash if it exceeds a preset temperature, which is documented somewhere in the manual, based on the troubleshooting section of the manual, it would also seem that the TCU varies the shift points based on fluid temperature.


I've seen this on a few transmissions, but the ones I have worked on still have a auto temp 'sensor' in the pan for the TCU, and have had an A/T overheat light as you have described. But the external reading has been an auto fluid temp 'switch' and only function is to display the A/T overheat light when the preset temperature is reached and nothing else. Not saying that yours is like this, but I've seen it done that way.

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Post Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 11:15 pm 
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This one is a thermistor - the resistance varies with the temperature - the transmission by the way, is an AW4, fitted to a Mitsubishi.

I took a look at the Jimny manual, that temp sensor is also a thermistor, and contrary to what was mentioned earlier, it appears to be mounted in the valve body, rather than in the pan itself (the pan has to be removed to access it)

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Post Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2016 12:40 am 
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Yes fluid temp sensors are usually attached by small bracket external of the valve body in the pan near the fluid filter pick up. But the bracket is retained using one or two of the 8mm valve body bolts and can be removed/replaced independent of the valve body.

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Post Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2016 6:19 pm 
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going to order a obd and have fun explaining to the wife what it is for :P

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Post Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2016 6:47 pm 
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Qthefun wrote:
going to order a obd and have fun explaining to the wife what it is for :P


What OBD2 dongle????

Shhh, it goes under the dash! :D

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Post Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2016 7:13 pm 
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DC3PTIKON wrote:
Qthefun wrote:
going to order a obd and have fun explaining to the wife what it is for :P


What OBD2 dongle????

Shhh, it goes under the dash! :D


PLX Kiwi 2 looks the goods!

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Post Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2016 7:19 pm 
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Qthefun wrote:
going to order a obd and have fun explaining to the wife what it is for :P


Good Idea. We have an oem quality temp sensor to tap into and know the parameters that that temp sensor in that location should operate within. so we are looking at 80-90deg from that sensor in that location to be within factory specs.

Just tell the wife the truth, you bought a cool gadget that allows you to monitor your engine and trans.

The OBD2 sensor we hooked up to my mates r50 pathfinder worked great. We overheated the engine in the desert (because american spec radiator) and the obd2 app would tell the exact temp when it started to increase well before the dash gauge did. It meant we had time to react and get the car in a cool spot to cool down. If we relied on just the Dash gauge we would have been in a little trouble i reckon as it only started climbing after the obd2 sensor already said it was hot.

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Post Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2016 7:26 pm 
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vet 180 wrote:
Qthefun wrote:
going to order a obd and have fun explaining to the wife what it is for :P


Good Idea. We have an oem quality temp sensor to tap into and know the parameters that that temp sensor in that location should operate within. so we are looking at 80-90deg from that sensor in that location to be within factory specs.

Just tell the wife the truth, you bought a cool gadget that allows you to monitor your engine and trans.

The OBD2 sensor we hooked up to my mates r50 pathfinder worked great. We overheated the engine in the desert (because american spec radiator) and the obd2 app would tell the exact temp when it started to increase well before the dash gauge did. It meant we had time to react and get the car in a cool spot to cool down. If we relied on just the Dash gauge we would have been in a little trouble i reckon as it only started climbing after the obd2 sensor already said it was hot.


Latin wife... some times the truth hurts lol

So vet do you think pulling out the obd2 sensor before service should keep us safe yer?

Literally just ordered it! like that it is expandable ;)

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Post Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2016 8:47 pm 
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There's no dramas using OBD scanners as far as the manufactures are concerned.

It's actually easier to communicate with them if you can say "I got 'A' and 'B' fault codes and would like you to look at and fix ......."


FWIW, I use a wifi dongle because it works with both my iPoo and my misses android phones.
The data is pretty close to actual, there's a slight delay in RPM from the dash gauge to the phone gauge, like a fraction of a second.
But I specifically bought mine to track fuel consumption and the graphs are pretty good with that type of data.

With most of the apps (I use torque mostly) you can set up custom dashes or gauges and easily monitor what ever your interested in.

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Post Posted: Mon Jan 18, 2016 9:02 pm 
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Qthefun wrote:
vet 180 wrote:
Qthefun wrote:
going to order a obd and have fun explaining to the wife what it is for :P


Good Idea. We have an oem quality temp sensor to tap into and know the parameters that that temp sensor in that location should operate within. so we are looking at 80-90deg from that sensor in that location to be within factory specs.

Just tell the wife the truth, you bought a cool gadget that allows you to monitor your engine and trans.

The OBD2 sensor we hooked up to my mates r50 pathfinder worked great. We overheated the engine in the desert (because american spec radiator) and the obd2 app would tell the exact temp when it started to increase well before the dash gauge did. It meant we had time to react and get the car in a cool spot to cool down. If we relied on just the Dash gauge we would have been in a little trouble i reckon as it only started climbing after the obd2 sensor already said it was hot.


Latin wife... some times the truth hurts lol

So vet do you think pulling out the obd2 sensor before service should keep us safe yer?

Literally just ordered it! like that it is expandable ;)


kkkk My wife is also latin (Brazilian)......trust me I know!

You could even keep the sensor in and they wont care, but I would pull it. There is no way for them to know you had it plugged in. It's also good as you are not adding another potential failure point. You also know the range of temp for that gauge in that location because as you have noticed gauge location will have different readings each person with their own opinion on what is correct.

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Post Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2016 7:46 am 
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Try and find a short dongle, mine is 5cm long and digs into my leg when driving.

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Post Posted: Tue Jan 19, 2016 8:01 am 
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shep wrote:
Try and find a short dongle, mine is 5cm long and digs into my leg when driving.


hahaha

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