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Dan's EFI bike project *Overload your brains in here!*
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Author:  JrZook [ Sat Mar 19, 2011 4:25 am ]
Post subject:  Dan's EFI bike project *Overload your brains in here!*
Well this may interest a few of you tech heads out there!

Well been pretty flat out at uni these days all well as being tied up in other projects but I have slowly been working on and collecting parts for my latest bike project.

So I'm attempting to EFI my XV250 suicycle as I will help in the long run especially if the turbo eventually finds it way on there plus I think it will be a pretty good project 8)

This fuel injection system is going to be completely custom from the injection manifold to the hardware as well as the software and tuning. It's a project Ive been wanting to test my skills on for a while! It will be a fairly long term project as there is craploads to do, design and test. I have got most of the parts collected to complete the project so here's a run
-down of what I have in mind:

Sequential injection
Ignition timing control
Custom siamese copper intake manifold
Yamaha R6 denso injectors
Single R6 EFI 38mm CV type throttle body
CBR 125 intank high pressure fuel pump converted to external inline use

The PCB in using is of my own design and is based around an atmel atmega 32 micro-controlled running at 8MHz. It has 2 injector as well as 2 coil drivers. Inputs will come from the stock crank reluctor pickup as well as a custom cam sensor. It will also be using the following sensors:

Throttle position (TPS)
Manifold air pressure (MAP)
Manifold air temp (MAT)
Engine temp
Battery voltage pickup

The fueling algorithm for now will be based on a volumetric efficiency (VE) map but later may include an alpha-n based map for lower engine speed if the MAP is not stable enough at low speeds.

Here are a few pics for now. I just got the PCB back and it will be the first prototype for the project. More pics to come!!

Image

Image
Top Side

Image
Bottom side

Enjoy!!
Dan
Author:  royce [ Sat Mar 19, 2011 4:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
Watching :)

By CV style throttle body you mean a slide throttle style thing?
Author:  Teracis [ Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
Nice, this sounds like an interesting project, got any pics of the bike as it stands now?
Author:  JrZook [ Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
royce wrote:
Watching :)

By CV style throttle body you mean a slide throttle style thing?


Correct! The Keihin EFI throttle bodies on the R6 still use a slide to keep the air velocity up, unlike a more complicated secondary butterfly system controlled by servos on other bikes. Simple yet effective 8)
Author:  JrZook [ Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
Teracis wrote:
Nice, this sounds like an interesting project, got any pics of the bike as it stands now?


Well this is when I just got it on the road:

Image

and the baby snail for it 8)

Image

Currently sits 3inch lower front and rear then in those pics.

Specs:

'94 yamaha virago XV250
Air/oil cooled 250cc, 60 degree odd fire v-twin
26mm single carb
21Hp stock!
16.8sec 1/4 mile (my best so far)

Aiming for 30Hp-ish with EFI
40-50 with EFI turbo
looking for 13-14sec 1/4mile times

Dan
Author:  Fatzook [ Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
somebody needs a manifold :lol:
Author:  boostedbrick [ Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
That turbo is gonna be a nut warmer
What are you looking at for oil feed on this dude? Im assuming taping a head feed would be easy on these motors but probally not enough pressure for a turbo, plus the chance of starving the head :?

Be cool to see how the EFI set up works 8)
Author:  Teracis [ Sat Mar 19, 2011 6:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
Bloody hell a 100% increase in hp is a fair target!

Good luck with it all, Hopefully you work out all the kinks without having it lock up on you or something dodgy while you're riding!
Author:  royce [ Sat Mar 19, 2011 6:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
JrZook wrote:
royce wrote:
Watching :)

By CV style throttle body you mean a slide throttle style thing?


Correct! The Keihin EFI throttle bodies on the R6 still use a slide to keep the air velocity up, unlike a more complicated secondary butterfly system controlled by servos on other bikes. Simple yet effective 8)


and no restriction when open :wink:

How about powering it? does the stator have enough reserve juice in it?
Author:  shakes [ Sat Mar 19, 2011 8:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
be following this with interest. a mate is thinking of going EFI on his postie bike. simply because he is an electronics nerd and wants to build it from scratch
Author:  JrZook [ Sun Mar 20, 2011 8:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
Fatzook wrote:
somebody needs a manifold :lol:


Yes Sir!!! I have everything here and waiting 8)
Author:  JrZook [ Sun Mar 20, 2011 8:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
royce wrote:
JrZook wrote:
royce wrote:
Watching :)

By CV style throttle body you mean a slide throttle style thing?


Correct! The Keihin EFI throttle bodies on the R6 still use a slide to keep the air velocity up, unlike a more complicated secondary butterfly system controlled by servos on other bikes. Simple yet effective 8)


and no restriction when open :wink:

How about powering it? does the stator have enough reserve juice in it?


Yea the stator was a bit of an issue to work out. They main extra sucker for power was the fuel pump so it took my a while to find one that will do the job. The one I have has ample flow and pressure and only uses a measly 2.5amps!! The stator should keep up, I hope!!
Author:  tanshi [ Sun Mar 20, 2011 9:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
your a freek Dan! looking forward to this!!
Author:  Chop [ Sun Mar 20, 2011 10:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
This is sweet, be interesting to see how she goes afterwards 8)

Ive been looking at a few old bikes lately, wouldnt mind converting one into a bobber :)
Author:  royce [ Wed Mar 23, 2011 11:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
how would this go on a 4cyl engine with 1 throttle body, 2 injectors and 2 wasted spark coils?
Author:  JrZook [ Wed Mar 23, 2011 11:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
royce wrote:
how would this go on a 4cyl engine with 1 throttle body, 2 injectors and 2 wasted spark coils?


What are you thinking? Mini with split runners? :lol: The hardware will support it and once ive written the software it should be able to be adapted.
Author:  royce [ Thu Mar 24, 2011 12:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
looking around at alternatives to a points dissy and stuff exisits but everyone that makes stuff for minis seems to think they are the most important person in the world and their gear is the best in teh world so you have to almost beg to be ripped off and buy their stuff

So I figure 2 birds one stone with some simple efi, but I am too stingy to fork out for the cool stuff :)

I would only need a crank trigger yeah? it wouldnt need a cam sensor to know what cylinder it was really on would it?
Author:  JrZook [ Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
royce wrote:
looking around at alternatives to a points dissy and stuff exisits but everyone that makes stuff for minis seems to think they are the most important person in the world and their gear is the best in teh world so you have to almost beg to be ripped off and buy their stuff

So I figure 2 birds one stone with some simple efi, but I am too stingy to fork out for the cool stuff :)

I would only need a crank trigger yeah? it wouldnt need a cam sensor to know what cylinder it was really on would it?


Both would be best but to keep it simplistic you could just run a cam pickup (or modify the dizzy) and make up a trigger system with a longer tooth/pulse to detect home of cyl 1
Author:  steak_knife [ Thu Mar 24, 2011 8:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
5k dizzy & use the pick up as a cam pos in the mini housing
Author:  royce [ Thu Mar 24, 2011 9:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
A, Mini dissy spins backwards
B, still has slop in teh drive system
C, No Toyota shit in the mini, ever

:)
Author:  TZAR [ Thu Mar 24, 2011 9:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
For Royce

ea falcon throttle body
simple throttle position switch and two injectors. Run one for standrad drive and then have second come on for full throttle

For Dan
Go hard son
Author:  royce [ Thu Mar 24, 2011 9:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
TZAR wrote:
For Royce

ea falcon throttle body
simple throttle position switch and two injectors. Run one for standrad drive and then have second come on for full throttle

For Dan
Go hard son


for Jock err TZAR
in a falcon the ECU does strange stuff so the injectors only fire every second cycle cause they are so big,m a mini stands no chance, and its hard to turbo stuff with it cause the pressure reg is all wrong
Author:  JrZook [ Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
TZAR wrote:
For Dan
Go hard son


Thanks Tzar!

royce wrote:

for Jock err TZAR
in a falcon the ECU does strange stuff so the injectors only fire every second cycle cause they are so big,m a mini stands no chance, and its hard to turbo stuff with it cause the pressure reg is all wrong


Im still skeptical about these 'issues' and weird happenings with this TBI system. Does anyone know what size injectors they actually run. Whats your mini royce? 1100, 1275?
Author:  royce [ Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
1098

Its in the Factory service manual, at idle and jsut of it only fires the injectors half the time, you can run the engine and slowly bring the revs up and hear where they click over and pick up the pulses

In a mini the manifold to fit it will be shit and cost you power, theres pretty solid info on what works and not, being its a 50 yo design and all
Author:  JrZook [ Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
Does the factory service manual give you an injector size?
Author:  royce [ Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
dunno, havent read one for many years :)
Author:  JrZook [ Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
Bit of an update:

Managed to pretty much finish populating the PCB!!

Image

Now its on to testing the PCB, write some code and test some hardware!! 8)
Author:  bazook [ Mon Apr 04, 2011 3:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
smart man 8) hope it all works out
Author:  SierraDan [ Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
Awesome!
Author:  shakes [ Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dan's XV250 custom EFI bike project
I wish I had the attention span to sit down and learn this sort of stuff.

Keep the updates coming!
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