[matfan]

http://www.lowrangeoffroad.com/suzuki/s ... -kits.html

Does anyone have any experience with these kits (or similar)? I'm considering doing the swap on my swb with new shock mounts and shocks. Any advice would be appreciated.


Edit: whoops wrong section... Can the mods please move this to tech..

[31zook]

i havn't nor do i know of anyone who has........ why don't you be the first

[matfan]

Well it seems popular in the states so it can't be all bad...... Hmmm if I order them now they should arrive in brissy shortly after me...

[ajsr]

31zook wrote:

i havn't nor do i know of anyone who has........ why don't you be the first

I'm fairly certain the bbm sliver sierra ran they in a drop shackle kit.

[reallyuted]

ive looked into doing this but am not sure if they will fit the rear of a lwbw/t? i do know you can buy old man emu springs at arb here, to save freight from the states! if you do decide to buy them i would be keen to come and have a look

[alien]

not exactly the best way of doing this mod IMO... theres all sort of wrong there i think. you're better to relocate the hangers using a chassis extension up front and using standard YJ shackles.

i took a different path, although along the same lines and put hilux front leaves all round in mine, which works a treat and other than doing the diff perches as well, is the same amount of work for a more readily available leaf spring (in australia).

[matfan]

alien wrote:

not exactly the best way of doing this mod IMO... theres all sort of wrong there i think. you're better to relocate the hangers using a chassis extension up front and using standard YJ shackles.

i took a different path, although along the same lines and put hilux front leaves all round in mine, which works a treat and other than doing the diff perches as well, is the same amount of work for a more readily available leaf spring (in australia).

What is 'all sort of wrong' with this method? I'm keen to nut this one out before jumping in head first either way.

Cheers

[alien]

- drop shackles
- shackle lengths
- shackle angles
- no brake lines
- no drive shaft changes
- no anti-wrap system
- no pinion angle correction (caster etc)
- no steering solution
- no shock absorber solution

...thats about all off the top of my head.

the amount of work to do it properly, you might as well weld on new perches and mounts and do it proper-properly (IMO). Also, you should consult an engineer before starting and see what their point of view is on how it should all be approached to be done as safe as possible.

[reallyuted]

I will still pursue this set up for my comp project but wont be for while yet

[matfan]

alien wrote:

- drop shackles - bolt them up
- shackle lengths they don't seem that long!
- shackle angles I'm too nooby to understand that one
- no brake lines required for big flex anyway
- no drive shaft changes wouldn't a spacer do the job
- no anti-wrap system the hype reckons that extra .5" leaf width helps
- no pinion angle correction (caster etc) hype says not required
- no steering solution don't you need this on all large lift?
- no shock absorber solution I'm thinking about the shock mount kit as well

...thats about all off the top of my head.

the amount of work to do it properly, you might as well weld on new perches and mounts and do it proper-properly (IMO). Also, you should consult an engineer before starting and see what their point of view is on how it should all be approached to be done as safe as possible.

I was going to use this in a spring under config as I'm after flex and not rediculous lift. Even though the front shackles are the missing link type, you can bolt them up (which I intended to do) to get rid of that highway dodgyness. (see pic)

[alien]

either way - you ask for advice from experience, and mine is that buying this kit is not the ideal means of running longer leaves.

as i said, consult an engineer and see what they have to say about the way this kit works vs. doing a cut off / weld on job.

[TryHard]

hey u said u want this kit mainly because of flex .... im stilling runing spua and when i had my old blue max springs in with 3 in the pack it flexed like mad .. i have seen the wrangler leaf swap kits and theres more work involved in getting it right then meets the eye ..

also what are u planing on doing why are u staying spua and what tyres are u running ..whats the plan basicly

[BlueSuzy]

An engineer wont pass extended shackles let alone extended shackles on extended shackles!

[steak_knife]

BlueSuzy wrote:

An engineer wont pass extended shackles let alone extended shackles on extended shackles!

That the top extended shackle's cant be pinned /locked, like a drop shackle.

Why not get home & drive it, you may be surprised at what it can do..

[matfan]

steak_knife wrote:

Why not get home & drive it, you may be surprised at what it can do..

I'm looking at the kit for my SWB which I've wrenched, wheeled and wrecked for a few years now and I'm always suprised at what it can do!

The LWB I just bought is more of a long term touring/camping project. I'll worry about engine swaps, bodywork and accessories before I look at the suspension department.

[skelaaleks]

I think standard drop shackle setup with slightly longer leaves on standard spring under.
I have about 2inch lift in my springs and the shackle closed up gives me about 1 inch over a standard shackle.
Flex's like a mad one and still good to drive on the road.
But you gotta get good shackles. mine also rotate to alow the relax instead of getting twisted in a knot. The also have a seat thing so it acts like a standard shackles when doing normal driving
V mounted shocks in the back and shock hoops in the front are advised. Aswell as 2" body lift (to fit 31x 10.5)

[skelaaleks]

http://www.google.com.au/m/search?site= ... ackles#i=3

[skyman]

I run Trail Tough's deluxe YJ kit. I can vouch for their kit. It handles exceptionally well on and off road. To add more I run it in SPOA with 33's.

I am a picky bastard when it comes to handling. I have to drive 35-80 miles to get to my trails, some of them I need to drive 15 miles of gravel roads after I get there to hit the trials. MY wife and 19 year old need to drive this thing on the freeway too. I wont drive a rig I have to fight to keep on the road, or be weary of. I want to relax when I drive, and not change my drawers when I get home. I don't want to have to worry about my family when they drive it either.

I know three other guys running The TT yj kit, and myself, that's local (small town). None of us have had any problems with it. I run mine like a sports car on the road, and I am a rough bastard off road. I have had the rig so vertical the front comes off the ground, and so steep down the rears have come up.

Keep in mind we all run a high steer, with new Tie rod ends, good shocks, and good steering, everything is in good shape. That is a must. Poly bushes also come in the kit. With worn out parts, or rubber bushes etc.. it won't handle as good.


Vendors can sell whatever they want here, but if people use it on the road, and causes injury they will be sued and out of business in short order. Our country is king of "I sued a McDonalds for 3 million cause I spilt my coffee" lol

Brent designed his kit to be stable, and for the masses who want a soft ride an bolt on 33's. Setup with his hardware, shock placement etc, it handles great and is safe to run at almost any speed. If it wasn't stable or capable, he would have gone with a solid shackle upfront instead of a missing link.

If A guy has the time, and experience to fab up a rig to run 33's spring under with a longer spring (Like YJ's CJ's or Toyota), and keep all the sheet metal, then by all means do it.

Where the rumors come from is home made, or poorly designed shackles. Homemade shackles are a nightmare, and fuck me dangerous. We all know what Sierra ghetto fab looks like. (I swear the poor sierras ar targets for rednecks)

Sorry for the huge post, but I see people bag on this suspension a lot, and a lot of it is because; "I heard they make you flip over backwards", " you don't need that much flex", or the best "if you hit the brakes your going to flip over forward". But I don't see any bad posts from people who actually run them daily "I ran them and I took them off because I was scared". I have never seen anyone say "I ran them and flipped nose over"


Please, note though, this is only the Trail Tough kit, I can't and won't recommend any other style of dual shackle.

I am happy to answer any questions you all have about the kit, or Missing links. I know we do stuff different here, our common 4.5" lift is a simple spoa yours seems to be a 2" body lift and 2" lift springs.

Hope it helps...maybe..

[reallyuted]

hey skyman do you use drive shaft extensions or have you used spacers or full custom shafts? are you still using the suzuki axel housings or have you changed to toyota or better? also do you use a power steer? are there any tricky parts of this conversion that i need to know before i do commit to this kit? i really like the bolt on idea as if or more like when my car gets defected i can still easily change to stanard items again cheers wayne

[reallyuted]

also how many leaves in your spring packs do you use 4 or 5? and are they a standard lenth or exteneded cheers wayne

[matfan]

skyman wrote:

Hope it helps...maybe..

Mate that is brilliant, thanks very much for that!

[skyman]

I use a 2" extended slip yoke in the rear, and two 1" drive line spacers in the front. (one on each end) the spacers up front help to clear the front cross member.

I am still running Sierra (what you call WT) axles. I run low backspace wheels as well so they stick out further for more stability.

For steering I run a petro works wedge, and vitara power steering. I also run Trail Tough's high steer. The high steer was well worth the coin. It replaces all your tie rod ends, and the drag link, so you get new joints along with no more bump steer.

The most important part I would say is the shock mounts. The way TT has you place them makes for a stable rig. They are as far out on the axle, and as vertical as you can get them. If you lean the shocks in, or put them too close together you don't get enough dampening to control the softer YJ springs.

The other answers your last question; get springs that are stiff enough for the weight of your rig, a light rig can run 4 packs up front, and 5 packs out back. A moderate to heavy rigs needs 5 packs all the way around, and heavy rig needs 6 packs front and rear.

Oh... poly bushes are required. They are like the shocks, for stability. The little things add up. Rubber bushes are too squishy for Missing links, and cause to much play in the shackles. The poly bushes really tighten the system all up and make for a lot better responding suspension.

If I were to do it again, I would use the YJ's with the same kit, but I would try 2" lift springs spring under. That should be about 1"-2" lower than Stock YJ's spring over, and set the sierra down on the 33" tires. If I wasn't happy with it I would remove a leaf or two and go spring over.

Trail tough sends out Doestech 8000's with their kits. They are a very firm shock. I think they do this to make the kit more stable as a whole (like I said above it's made for the masses). The doestech's ran really good on road, but were a little stiff off road. I went to rancho 9000's about a year ago and I am happier now that I can run them at "high" on the road, and med to soft off road.

Here's what I believe makes the kit work so well, and stable on road.

* 2-3" of up travel max with built in shock bumpstops. (limit's the ability to lean on off camber or hard turns)

* Stiff shocks (keeps the rig stable in hard turns, and limits body roll & sway)

* Shocks mounted vertical for maximum dampening.

* Poly bushes to stiffen up the shackle and limit side to side sway.

* TT recommends 5-6 packs springs for their stiffness, controls body roll and sway.

* Poly bushings in between the links for friction. This puts tension and friction on the links and keeps them from "flopping" open or closed.

The J shaped shackle up front, and the short Missing link out back also help to keep the height down. All of the above is what is very important to get right. Working together they make for a stable rig, and that is why I only recommend trail tough's kit. Anyone who makes or sells that kind of a kit/link without pointing out the important stuff, doesn't have the owners best interest in ind, and I think it's kind of irresponsible.


The way I looked at it when I bought the kit was that the way the shackles rest, it would be very easy to pin, or bolt them shut. I figured if I didn't like it I would pin them shut, and be done with it. So I looked at them as kind of a bolt on frame extension to fit YJ's. I really kind of forgot about bolting or pining them, because they haven't been a problem in 3 years of constant use.

I was looking for the soft ride form the YJ's (guess I am getting old), and the wheel base they give by moving the axles forward in the wheel well.

If you are going SPOA you will need to be able to weld on the spring perches and shock towers, or have it done for you. Spring under, just the shock towers. The trail tough shocks towers on the front are ford F-250 truck, bolt on shock towers. They can be picked up here for $12.50 at the ford dealer. since you are over in AU, it might be better to get what you guys have available and use. The placement for a max uptravel of 3" (after bump stop squish). Is what is important up front.


IMHO
Since you can get defected there, and may have to remove it, I think I would do it different if I lived there (can you weld/cut/fab etc?).

All that is needed to make rear YJ's work is a relocation bracket, and a longer rear shackle with a "Y" shape to go from Sierra spring hanger, to 2-1/2" springs. In the front, a short frame extension and a longer shackle (same as rear) would get your springs under the rig as well. Then if I wanted to run 33' I'd run the shortest lift spring possible and keep it spring under.

That would give you the flex and ride of a longer spring but,
*keep you spring under so it could get engineered.
*Get rid of the missing links so you could get engineered.

I just don't know how I would feel about putting YJ's under my rig and getting defected then have to take it all off.

If you have any questions, like I said I am happy to answer.
Here's a shot of my rig (probably seen it before) and how it sits with YJ's and 33's spring over. I can throw a flex picture up if you want, too.

[matfan]

A flex pic would be great if you can.

[skyman]

Sure, it will go more but that's all I tat was around at the time.it;s kinda silly how much flex it has. I don't think all of that flex is needed, but the suspension works well so I am not complaining armsup

[matfan]

That's brilliant mate, definitely food for thought.

[skyman]

I forgot to say if you look at the front missing link you can see it has barely opened, and just started to leave the pad it rests on.

That missing link opens up all the way and goes near vertical when completely flexed out. I will see if I can dig up some pics that show it maxed out (on the old computer)

[skyman]

Next time I go up I will see if I can take some video of it on the rough at speed, and maybe some off camber stuff so you can see how it works.

It took me 3 months to decide on a suspension lol It's alot of money to just "drop" on a suspension.

[ajsr]

skyman wrote:

Next time I go up I will see if I can take some video of it on the rough at speed, and maybe some off camber stuff so you can see how it works.

It took me 3 months to decide on a suspension lol It's alot of money to just "drop" on a suspension.

Are you sure your american?????

[skyman]

Hahah you made me crack a smile.

If I could come up with pair of plane tickets for a test run down there, I might ahem..just forget to take a return flight armsup

Not only do you guys you guys have everything I like to do, wheel snorkel, spear fish, fish, camp, surf. You have the best in the world.

I don't know about trading our rattlesnake and black widows for your eastern browns and red back's

[Fatzook]

skyman wrote:

I don't know about trading our rattlesnake and black widows for your eastern browns and red back's

You can do worse here I've been bitten by a redback. I was 12 at the time and didn't notice until I got home from school and took my shoe off. The redback fell out, then my foot swelled up. I had some minor discomfort and felt a little nausious for a day or so but thats it.

Now the brown recluse spider bite is one to fear! 10yrs of disfiguring woulds and excrutiating pain!


Or getting jabbed by our cute Platypus


From Wiki "Although powerful enough to kill smaller animals, the venom is not lethal to humans. However, it produces excruciating pain which may be intense enough to incapacitate the victim. Swelling rapidly develops around the entry wound and gradually spreads outwards. Information obtained from case studies shows that the pain develops into a long-lasting hyperalgesia that can persist for months but usually lasts from a few days to a few weeks. A clinical report from 1992 showed that the severe pain was persistent and did not respond to morphine"