[preecy]

hey guys
i want to put an vitara auto in my vitara just woundering dose the manuel tranfer bolt straight up to the auto.

swb 1992 model vitara

if anyone know that would be great if u could share sum info

cheers

[Jester]

you probably would get the whole trans and transfer together as one unit in a vit, 92 thats still a carby one isnt it?
if so the auto for them really sucks and is really hard to get one for it, i converted mine from auto to manual, cos the auto was shagged and the previous owners had looked for about 12 months to try and get one, and we also had one in at work with auto issues and cos we figured we would have a hard time getting anything, we sent them to a specific auto specialist, and they took 2 weeks to find one and said it was the only one they could find in Australia with warranty on it and they had to get it from Sydney (im in Adelaide)

And the 4spd auto from the EFI vit well we dont have an ecu to control it

honestly id say keep it manual unless you wanna do the EFI conversion at the same time

[Gwagensteve]

It's a bolt up AFAIK.

Steve.

[preecy]

Jester wrote:

you probably would get the whole trans and transfer together as one unit in a vit, 92 thats still a carby one isnt it?
if so the auto for them really sucks and is really hard to get one for it, i converted mine from auto to manual, cos the auto was shagged and the previous owners had looked for about 12 months to try and get one, and we also had one in at work with auto issues and cos we figured we would have a hard time getting anything, we sent them to a specific auto specialist, and they took 2 weeks to find one and said it was the only one they could find in Australia with warranty on it and they had to get it from Sydney (im in Adelaide)

And the 4spd auto from the EFI vit well we dont have an ecu to control it

honestly id say keep it manual unless you wanna do the EFI conversion at the same time

aw k thanks mate i can get a auto for 250 with no transfer thats all just woundering if it worth my while and if it bolts up

[Gwagensteve]

Jester you are kidding aren't you? They're just a trimatic. They turn up here in pull it yourself wreckers all the time. Sure there are some vitara specific parts.... but the service/rebuild parts are all off the shelf trimatic bits.

I've just converted a Manual vitara to trimatic auto, with parts from a wrecked car that was being thrown out. We've thrown in a twinsticked 4:1 geared case and steel airlocked 5.12 diffs at the same time.

Whilst the trimatic has a tallish 1st gear, no overdrive, and does consume a fair mount of power, it still owns a manual offroad. Totally owns it. If you are running really big, heavy tyres, you might want a bit higher stall in the converter to get more punch off the line, but that's no biggy.

I've built two trimatic engined cars (not counting the conversion) and the owners love them. They are running 4:1/6.5:1 transfers and 3.9:1 diff gears with 35/36" tyres. They cruise on the highway fine and work very well offroad. The autos are all stock with large coolers. ONe has a stock 1.6 in front of it, the other a baleno EFI. The baleno EFI has plenty of power on the road on Q78 swampers.

Yes, the AW-4 (4 speed) is an excellent automatic. It does need some wiring tricks to get it to run without a TCC, (or some inputs to the TCC to get the suzuki TCC to run it) it has a lower 1st gear, an overdrive, and a steeper converter ratio. It's an excellent offroad automatic, but it is more work to fit (even into a vitara) as the EFI vitaras used a different chassis design and the crossmembers are in different positions. Not impossible to overcome but more work, especially when you add in electronics. The manual transfer will also bolt to the AW-4 as well as the trimatic. I have done this. (i.e swapped the same transfer from manual to AW-4 to Trimatic.

preecy, unless you go to dual transfers, IMHO your gearing will be marginal with a manual with the setup you are planning. You'd be better off with an auto. you won't regret it.

Steve.

[Jester]

fair nuff steve, I stand corrected, i spose ive only driven them on the way out,

but here in SA I have a very hard time finding vit bits in wreckers, I have one i go to, most car wreckers say its a 4wd we wont stock it, most 4wd wreckers say its not a 'real' 4wd we wont stock it.

[joeblow]

Jester wrote:

fair nuff steve, I stand corrected, i spose ive only driven them on the way out,

but here in SA I have a very hard time finding vit bits in wreckers, I have one i go to, most car wreckers say its a 4wd we wont stock it, most 4wd wreckers say its not a 'real' 4wd we wont stock it.

don't worry....i hate them with a passion too.

[kenn]

Hands up, who hates Traumatics

[joeblow]

[kenn]

Anyone else? Bueller? Bueller?

[Gwagensteve]

*honest question*

What are the SPECIFIC problems with the trimatic?

The obvious shortcomings (2.54 first, 1.8 converter ratio and no overdrive) are there for everyone to see and not every car requires the features of the AW-4.

For the record, my next car will have a 4 speed auto in it because my desired gearing won't permit me to run a three speed, but I'd happily run a C4 or a trimatic if my choice of gearing and engine allowed.

Steve.

[kenn]

Gwagensteve wrote:

*honest question*

What are the SPECIFIC problems with the trimatic?


Steve.

They fell out of the backend of a dinosaur..

For the amount of weight you gain , I'd rather have the extra gear and Japanese reliablity and technology.

[preecy]

Gwagensteve wrote:

Jester you are kidding aren't you? They're just a trimatic. They turn up here in pull it yourself wreckers all the time. Sure there are some vitara specific parts.... but the service/rebuild parts are all off the shelf trimatic bits.

I've just converted a Manual vitara to trimatic auto, with parts from a wrecked car that was being thrown out. We've thrown in a twinsticked 4:1 geared case and steel airlocked 5.12 diffs at the same time.

Whilst the trimatic has a tallish 1st gear, no overdrive, and does consume a fair mount of power, it still owns a manual offroad. Totally owns it. If you are running really big, heavy tyres, you might want a bit higher stall in the converter to get more punch off the line, but that's no biggy.

I've built two trimatic engined cars (not counting the conversion) and the owners love them. They are running 4:1/6.5:1 transfers and 3.9:1 diff gears with 35/36" tyres. They cruise on the highway fine and work very well offroad. The autos are all stock with large coolers. ONe has a stock 1.6 in front of it, the other a baleno EFI. The baleno EFI has plenty of power on the road on Q78 swampers.

Yes, the AW-4 (4 speed) is an excellent automatic. It does need some wiring tricks to get it to run without a TCC, (or some inputs to the TCC to get the suzuki TCC to run it) it has a lower 1st gear, an overdrive, and a steeper converter ratio. It's an excellent offroad automatic, but it is more work to fit (even into a vitara) as the EFI vitaras used a different chassis design and the crossmembers are in different positions. Not impossible to overcome but more work, especially when you add in electronics. The manual transfer will also bolt to the AW-4 as well as the trimatic. I have done this. (i.e swapped the same transfer from manual to AW-4 to Trimatic.

preecy, unless you go to dual transfers, IMHO your gearing will be marginal with a manual with the setup you are planning. You'd be better off with an auto. you won't regret it.

Steve.

thanx for the insite mate

[steak_knife]

joeblow wrote:

spoze so.

[joeblow]

Gwagensteve wrote:

*honest question*

What are the SPECIFIC problems with the trimatic?

very poor build quality.
noisy.
KNOWN for failure. (this includes the many i had come to the workshop)
poor power, poor gearing.
if the vacuum modulator diaphram splits it WILL suck atf back into your motor and destroy bottom ends.
no drain plug on sump.
sump too wide.

yada yada yada......

[Gwagensteve]

The vacuum diaphram point is interesting, but that's not unique to the trimatic? I can think of at least one easy fix.

I think the other issues have either been covered, aren't relevant for an infrequently driven offroad car. Dropping the pan once a year isn't a biggy - it's a good opportunity to change the filter, no?

1.0 litre front driveshaft clears the pan fine in a Sierra.... and it clears fine in a vitara, which is what preecy runs.

[preecy]

Gwagensteve wrote:

The vacuum diaphram point is interesting, but that's not unique to the trimatic? I can think of at least one easy fix.

I think the other issues have either been covered, aren't relevant for an infrequently driven offroad car. Dropping the pan once a year isn't a biggy - it's a good opportunity to change the filter, no?

1.0 litre front driveshaft clears the pan fine in a Sierra.... and it clears fine in a vitara, which is what preecy runs.

hey guys i for got to mention its only gunna be driven offroad no road driveing done

[joeblow]

you can't say some of us tried to warn you.

[preecy]

joeblow wrote:

you can't say some of us tried to warn you.

so is it worth my while or just stay with the manuel with 5:29 diff gears and 4:24:1 reduction gears??

[kenn]

That looks ace ! It would be a shame to spoil it with a crap auto , I would either stick with the manual or put an AW4 auto in it, you won't regret it ..

[Gwagensteve]

I think this has been covered before, but it depends what and how you drive. If you want to crawl stuff, you want an auto. Really, you do.

Sure, your car will drive fine with 81:1 crawl, but the moment you see someone driving the same stuff you do with an auto, you'd give your left nut for one.

Fitting and wiring an AW-4 is not worth the effort in your application. most of the advantage of the AW-4 is the overdrive and the lockup converter for highway work. Even of you do drive your car on road, it's tyre size and high range gearing won't let you pull O/D or lock the converter.

Joe, I know the AW-4 is a better auto, but it's not better enough to justify the work in an offroad car - all you need is a torque converter.How the gears are engaged or if you have to pull the pan from time to time just isn't relevant. An OD is just a waste.

Steve.

[got_bar_work]

my boss has a hq panelvan drag car with a trimatic bolted to a 500hp 253 and it never has a problem.
so i recon u would never kill it with a 1.6 if u look after it

[Gwagensteve]

Hugo's racematics can build them to take 600hp on the strip. I'm sure that's expensive though. I had mine (which has been sold to a clubmember and runs fine in stock forms) priced up for a rebuild with all the H/D widgets (improved seals, HD sprags etc) and it was about $600.

Steve.

[dmould66]

ive been running trimatic with 31" tyres for years, the harder the going the more i like it, never had any reliability probs either, done thousands of k's, love it!

[preecy]

ok thanx guys ive been told if i spend the money on it and manueliez it , it wud be worth my while everyone ive talked to says they r crap when standard but r pritty gud when upgraded with better clutch packs and other stuff autos have loli dont no to much about autos yet

does anyone know where i can get it upgraded in the hunter valley area??

[joeblow]

if it were me having to spend that money......and i hate spending money on a component more than once.....and i couldn't go the aw4 i'd be running a manual with the trailtough undertaker.

on the few occasions i have sold a trimatic i have allways told people of thier shortcommings and what to look out for, with the aw4......i don't have to.


unfortunately there is a lot of talk as to IF you do this to the trimatic and IF you do that to the trimatic.........with the aw4 you have to do NOTHING. and as far as the manual is concerned as long as you look after the clutch it will last a very long time too.

[Gwagensteve]

Let it go Joe, Preecy has plenty of information now.

[dmould66]

wot cars can i pull trimatics out of, i love them so much i whant to buy some more, might even put a picture of one up on my wall.love um love um LOVE UM.

[joeblow]

Gwagensteve wrote:

Let it go Joe,

WTF was i holding onto in the first place ya garden gnome?



information is all.

[dmould66]

what cars can i pull a fantastic trymatic out of? did i mention i realy love them? sometimes i lie awake thinking about my lovely trimatic just sitting under my vit just waiting for me to slip it into drive and seamlesly waft over some obstacle. did i tell you about when i layed under it sucking the modulator pipe or when i undid its lovely sump bolts and had its lovely juices gush out over me! i love it! love it! but then im probably just a garden gnome? wtf does that mean?