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Gear box leak, sierra
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Author:  Choppy [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:00 am ]
Post subject:  Gear box leak, sierra
hey guys, ive got a leak coming out of the shaft running from the transfer to my gearbox. as shown in the pics the dark ring freely rotates about 30-45 degrees and a couple of mm backwards and forwards. there are to nicks indicated within the circle.
the leak is very slow, not enough to drip on the ground

questions:
1. what role does this part play?
2. is it meant to move?
3. are the nicks broken welds? would re-welding fix or does it have to be evenly balanced?
4. how is the shaft connected within the box? ie does it just slide in and held by the four bolts at the transfer end? would a new shaft fix this problem?
5. is this a major issue, ie urgent fix
6. ultimately how do i fix?

sorry for the questions i have no idea with this stuff, any help appreciated

choppy
Author:  steak_knife [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
G/box out put shaft seal, lil bit tricky to fit but nothing you can't handle.. :P
Author:  Choppy [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
steknig wrote:
G/box out put shaft seal, lil bit tricky to fit but nothing you can't handle.. :P


thanks stek, where would i get one? wats tricky? getting the shaft out, getting the seal out, putting the seal in?
Author:  appsie [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
removing the jackshaft is quick and easy
the seal was the hardest bit for me gettin the old one out.
new one took a few seconds to fit,tapped in nicely and cost about $3.50 from bearing shop
Author:  Rusho [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
A decent seal removing tool would be a decent help also
Author:  Choppy [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
appsie wrote:
removing the jackshaft is quick and easy
the seal was the hardest bit for me gettin the old one out.
new one took a few seconds to fit,tapped in nicely and cost about $3.50 from bearing shop


fair enough, AWESOME, glad its an easy fix, do most places have them in stock? is it urgent probably wont be able to get around to it for about a week?

thanks also
Author:  appsie [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 9:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
mine leaked for months and months,and from day one of picking it up which was a full reco box :evil:

when i removed the old one you could see where they have damaged the sealing area of the gearbox housing previously doing a seal.x2 on getting a decent seal remover,i had to muck around with what i had
Author:  lump_a_charcoal [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
Get a genuine suzuki seal too, I have had nothing but problems with after market ones.
Author:  303zuke [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
Rusho81 wrote:
A decent seal removing tool would be a decent help also

I got that:
Author:  steak_knife [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
303zuke wrote:
Rusho81 wrote:
A decent seal removing tool would be a decent help also

I got that:



I didn't want to say that.

Your hammer's a bit small tho. :roll: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Author:  Rusho [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 11:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
Is that left or right handed though???
Author:  steak_knife [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 11:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
Rusho81 wrote:
Is that left or right handed though???


Left I'd say, it's on the left of the screw stripper. :roll:
Author:  303zuke [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 11:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
Choppy, there are 2 parts to your question, the oil leak and the loose collar on the jackshaft. We've established that a worn oil seal is the cause of our leak and that it is reasonably easy to replace. The jackshaft is fixed in place by the bolts on the T/case end of the shaft, while the G/box end is a sliding spline on the output shaft of the gearbox. The outer surface of this spline is a seal surface that is pretty critical to the ability of the seal to retain oil. If the vehicle has done lots of K's, it is possible that the seal surface has a groove worn in it from the seal lip, particularly if grit has found it's way in there. If so, a new seal will not work and you will need to either Speedi-Sleeve it or replace it altogether.

To prevent grit and crap from getting in there in the first place, there is a collar on the jackshaft which covers the seal and surface. This is what has come loose on your jackshaft. With it separate from the rest of the spline yoke, it opens up a more direct path to the seal for grit. You want to close it back up. As it is only light guage metal compared to the yoke, if it is welded slightly off centre it won't affect the balance of the shaft, but you may as well try to get it right. It is important though to ensure it is centred enough that it will not foul the gearbox seal housing as it rotates, otherwise it will annoy the crap out of you until it cuts away it's own bit of alloy for clearance.
Author:  Choppy [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
303zuke wrote:
Choppy, there are 2 parts to your question, the oil leak and the loose collar on the jackshaft. We've established that a worn oil seal is the cause of our leak and that it is reasonably easy to replace. The jackshaft is fixed in place by the bolts on the T/case end of the shaft, while the G/box end is a sliding spline on the output shaft of the gearbox. The outer surface of this spline is a seal surface that is pretty critical to the ability of the seal to retain oil. If the vehicle has done lots of K's, it is possible that the seal surface has a groove worn in it from the seal lip, particularly if grit has found it's way in there. If so, a new seal will not work and you will need to either Speedi-Sleeve it or replace it altogether.

To prevent grit and crap from getting in there in the first place, there is a collar on the jackshaft which covers the seal and surface. This is what has come loose on your jackshaft. With it separate from the rest of the spline yoke, it opens up a more direct path to the seal for grit. You want to close it back up. As it is only light guage metal compared to the yoke, if it is welded slightly off centre it won't affect the balance of the shaft, but you may as well try to get it right. It is important though to ensure it is centred enough that it will not foul the gearbox seal housing as it rotates, otherwise it will annoy the crap out of you until it cuts away it's own bit of alloy for clearance.


thanks for the detailed help but please excuse my ignorance, what your saying is this collar is not meant to be moving and is effectivly meant to seal the area from crap entering the box yes? how is it usually fixd in place? what is speedi-sleeve?. i think jas has a shaft lying around, if i were to get that and chuck that in would that fix my issue i.e. is the collar atatched to the shaft or box? if iget time i might pull it out tomorrow and have a look around. is the inside of where the shaft goes into the box (nothing sus) meant to be complelty smooth, i.e any groves will indicate what you stated above in bold?

thanks heaps guys
Author:  303zuke [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 2:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
The collar is welded to the yoke part of the jackshaft. The rough bits you can see are the cracked welds.

When you take the shaft out of the back of the gearbox, it is like a hollow tube. The inner surface is splined to grip the output shaft of the gearbox, and the outer surface is smooth for the seal to run on. What you don't want to see is a groove worn around the outer surface where the seal rubs.

A Speedi-Sleeve is a shim-thick piece of stainless steel used to repair a worn seal surface on a shaft. They are available in a range of sizes to suit just about any size shaft. They do not bear a load, just provide a clean smooth seal surface. They are available from bearing shops.
Author:  303zuke [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 2:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
I dont have a pic handy of a Sierra Box and Shaft at this time of night, but this is from another vehicle of mine and will give you an idea of what I am talking about.

The shaft coming out of the back of the box has splines that engage the inside of the yoke. The outside is smooth so the seal in the back of the box has a good surface to seal against. As you can see on the yoke, there is a small groove worn into the seal surface by the lip of the seal. THIS IS BAD, and will leak no matter how new the seal is. You can also see the yoke does not have a collar or sheild to protect the seal and stop grit from getting on the seal. Dats how it got that way!
Author:  Choppy [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
thanks heaps 303, there is only one way to learn this stuff and its from the experts :wink: , grealty appreciated

choppy
Author:  ajsr [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 10:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
two ways
buy a manual and read it :wink:
thats the best way I think
but good on you for having a go, too many people JUST give it to a mechanic because it looks too hard.
Author:  Choppy [ Sat Jun 12, 2010 11:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
ajsr wrote:
two ways
buy a manual and read it :wink:
thats the best way I think
but good on you for having a go, too many people JUST give it to a mechanic because it looks too hard.


haha cheers, yeah ill have a look at it next week when im meant to be studying for exams . . . :roll:
Author:  Chopz [ Sun Jun 13, 2010 10:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
i was under my sierra today and the shaft on mine moves about 30-45 degrees if ya twist it, however not back and forth.
it also has those notches your referring to. I dont beleive they are cracked welds they look like they are fabbed like that
Author:  Choppy [ Sun Jun 13, 2010 10:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Gear box leak, sierra
Chopz wrote:
i was under my sierra today and the shaft on mine moves about 30-45 degrees if ya twist it, however not back and forth.
it also has those notches your referring to. I dont beleive they are cracked welds they look like they are fabbed like that


yeah theres actually more then 2 notches, i think thees tree or four, had a look on SI3RR4's sierra and his doesnt move . . . ill rip it out sometime this week and have a look anyway
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