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Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
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Author:  zooker [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:46 am ]
Post subject:  Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
Put a 2nd hand engine in my zook on the weekend. Got it all hooked up, cranked it over and it started up and ran beautifully.....for about 1 minute. Then there was a snap and the engine stopped dead. :?

Turned out it had stripped the teeth on the timing belt, which effectively stopped the engine. After some inspection I realised that I couldnt turn the camshaft with my standard ratchet. However, if I use a breaker bar the camshaft does turn with the extra leverage.

My question is, how easy should the camshaft turn?

Since my camshaft is hard to turn, can I assume it has seized. If so, why would this have happened after only about 1-2 minutes running? and what will need replacing? :roll:

This engine is starting to seriously shit me so any assistance you guys can provide is appreciated.
Author:  steak_knife [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
The cam won't be easy to turn, it should of rolled over lobe's, so hard then spin out of you hand..

Fit new belt with all mark in line & start it..
Author:  Fatzook [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 6:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
If the cam shaft was siezed, I doubt you could turn it. But there should be some resistance though.

If the cam is dead, the head is dead. The cam usually ruins the journal it runs in when they seize.

Take the tapet cover off and inspect the top end.
Author:  zooker [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 7:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
I've taken the tappet cover off and I cant see any missing bolts. None of the rocker arms are busted as far as I can tell. And theres still plenty of oil hanging round, so it wasn't running without oil supply.

I guess I'll just wack a new belt on, stand back and hope for the best :? . I'll do it tomorrow though, its bloody cold outside atm :lol:
Author:  foolsp33d [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 7:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
while the rocker cover is of crack n retorque the cam bolts.... check the oil pickup IS actually working.. I learnt the hard way to with the 1.0 two belts in as many days.. :(
fixed but soon after the car went mia.. :evil:
Author:  zooker [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 10:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
How can I check the oil pickup is working?
Author:  Fatzook [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 10:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
zooker wrote:
How can I check the oil pickup is working?


Oil pressure guage? :?
Author:  joeblow [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 10:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
10 bucks...........heads dead.
Author:  Built4thrashing [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 10:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
you will get fresh oil comming up into the head when you crank it over.

B4T
Author:  BlueSuzy [ Thu Aug 19, 2010 11:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
How many k's on the engine?

How long was it sitting around for?

PooR GeofF :cry:
Author:  zooker [ Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
Dunno k's. Approx 130'000 if the bloke the previous owner bought it off was telling the truth. The engine came out of a running car and was only sitting for about 2 months.

I put a spare timing belt on it thisarvo but I noticed that its a little loose. The tensioner is at the max of its adjustment and the belt is still easily deflected inwards, not tight like I would expect it to be :? :?:

Cranked it over but it backfired a bit and wouldnt start, so I suspect I have the timing 180 degrees out (even though I followed the haynes manual directions with the timing marks etc :roll: ) Too fricken cold at the moment so I'll check the dizzy alignment tomorrow.
Author:  zooker [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 2:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
Ok, here it goes.

Put a new timing belt on it, cranked it over for a while with the plugs out to build up some oil pressure. I could see the oil being pumped up onto the camshaft so seemed to me to be in order.

Plugs went back in and I started it up. Ran fine for about 10 seconds then went real rough and seized, stopped instantly.

I've pulled timing belt off again (it was still good) and the camshaft appears to be seized. I can not physically turn it.

Why the hell would a camshaft seize after 10 seconds :?: :?

I am at a complete loss since there was oil so I dont see how it could have seized due to lack of lubrication.
Author:  steak_knife [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 3:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
joeblow wrote:
10 bucks...........heads dead.


I now agree with joe..

it was worth a try tho..
Author:  shakes [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
Have you had the sump off and looked at the oil pickup??

http://auszookers.com/index.php?name=Fo ... sc&start=0

Look on both pages of that, goes into a little more detail of exactly what I went through, easier than re-typing it all here. also loosen the camshaft, lube with engine assembly paste and re-torque.

How confident are you that the timing was set perfectly?
Author:  shakes [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
zooker wrote:
Ok, here it goes.

Put a new timing belt on it, cranked it over for a while with the plugs out to build up some oil pressure. I could see the oil being pumped up onto the camshaft so seemed to me to be in order.

Plugs went back in and I started it up. Ran fine for about 10 seconds then went real rough and seized, stopped instantly.

I've pulled timing belt off again (it was still good) and the camshaft appears to be seized. I can not physically turn it.

Why the hell would a camshaft seize after 10 seconds :?: :?

I am at a complete loss since there was oil so I dont see how it could have seized due to lack of lubrication.


I also had "some oil" being pumped up to the head. remove the spark and the oil sender if it is only trickling out while being cranked over your not getting enough oil. If it's shooting across your engine bay after you have cleaned your oil pickup then money is on the head is dead.
Author:  zooker [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 5:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
Shakes - Thanks for your advice. That is almost exactly what happened to me.

I've checked my oil pickup and it is still spotless because I cleaned it before I put this engine in the car. I did notice that the cam gear locating pin hole is slightly ovalled, though not as extreme as yours was. When I was cranking the engine I could see the oil being squirted up enough to coat the cam, but it wasnt like it was shooting across the engine bay.

Was your engine repairable after seizing or was a whole new head needed?
Author:  shakes [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 6:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
It shoots out the oil sender in the side of the block, only a trickle into the head/cam guides.

Mine seem's to be repairable (only ran it for 15-20 mins afterwards havent driven it)

loosen the cam off, lube it all up and re-tighten. Turn by hand a heap of full rotations, if it tightens up then remove your head and take it to get reco'd ($400ish for a full go by the quotes I got) and someone here had a cam regrind specs that seemed to be worth doing to.
Author:  Scrawny [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 7:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
shakes wrote:
It shoots out the oil sender in the side of the block, only a trickle into the head/cam guides.

Mine seem's to be repairable (only ran it for 15-20 mins afterwards havent driven it)

loosen the cam off, lube it all up and re-tighten. Turn by hand a heap of full rotations, if it tightens up then remove your head and take it to get reco'd ($400ish for a full go by the quotes I got) and someone here had a cam regrind specs that seemed to be worth doing to.


Brand new heads can be had for around the $500 mark
Author:  shakes [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 10:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
Bare head? or complete? From suzuki themselves or from a repo joint?

The $400 was for new valves and seals, quick tidy up, pressure test, check cam and journals for true, machine all 3 surfaces and be a bolt on affair.
Author:  honks [ Sat Aug 21, 2010 9:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
not sure if there still on there but seen new head complete on ebay for around $400-$500 the other week
Author:  stockman [ Mon Aug 23, 2010 10:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
You should of bought my motor. It was tight.
Sucks as hardly any spares pop up here in canb/qbn.
I tried flynns wreckers the other week and they had nothing.
Author:  Red_October [ Mon Aug 23, 2010 11:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Stripped timing belt. Seized camshaft???
PM sent :P
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