auszookers.com
https://auszookers.com/forum/

GTI Engine with gears
https://auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=32947		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Daz7 [ Mon May 28, 2012 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:  GTI Engine with gears
Been doing some research with regard to engine swaps for the sierra.

Logical swap is the G16B, its the torque monster of the group, largest capacity, etc etc.... however to do it right, I really have to do the vit box too or go auto as it appears the G13B gearbox can't take that much torque constantly.

I'm also trying to keep weight down on most items, so heavier gearbox, slightly heavier engine isn't going where I want to go. Added complexity then arises with the Vit gearbox swap.

My build specs are N/T with 6:4.1 transfer gears running around a 31" tyre, lockers front and rear. I'm aiming for capable all rounder. Not Tuff Truck entrant.

Its going to love revs on the road, the G16B only likes to rev to 5500 or so whilst the 1.3 GTI engine will rocket up to 7k easily. Thinking out loud, should I be looking at the GTI engine as a simpler bolt in alternative?

In NSW the GTI engine wouldn't require engineering nor a conversion kit, so apart from wiring and the like its an easier and cheaper way out.

Offroad - the downfall when you talk of GTI conversions. However, are most of these conversions that we point to as not performing offroad geared down, or are they mostly standard vehicles with an engine conversion and large tyres? I'm thinking that with the much lower gearing, the lower torque output of the GTI engine may not be that much of a problem.

My only experience with a GTI engined Sierra's was a LWB with group A internals that a mate built for Trakka Van and drove in the Wynns Safari event years ago.

thoughts?
Author:  jonno_racing [ Mon May 28, 2012 4:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
this comes up once every few weeks.
imho and experiance (and I have done more than a handful of gti conversions) a geared gti powered zook is a thrill and fun to drive, but on top of that it WORKS. the instant power and rev range of a gti makes it a great combo.

however a whole lot of people with NO real world experiance are about to tell you its a crap conversion.
Author:  Daz7 [ Mon May 28, 2012 4:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
Thanks, have searched quite a bit over the weekend but found lots of talk on the conversion but not a lot of real world use feedback (especially when geared).
Author:  mrgtt34 [ Mon May 28, 2012 4:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
Hey there , you mite get some negitive feed back about the G13b but i run a fairly high comp twin cam with 6.5 gears and i mostly use it for cheap travel to and from work but im realy happy with it. also run N/t gears with F-R lockers and 31s sits about 3700 at 100 some where there any way . with a healthy engine i dont have any trouble at all climbing on rocks or what ever .Only down side is they have all been raped in the gtis so expect to build it and as long as you do it right it wont let you down . They come to life with gears
Author:  jonno_racing [ Mon May 28, 2012 4:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
Daz7 wrote:
Thanks, have searched quite a bit over the weekend but found lots of talk on the conversion but not a lot of real world use feedback (especially when geared).

I think most of the negative info written about the gti is either from people with no real idea or experiance on the matter.
if you are happy to crawl along at no lower than 1500rpm+ the benifits of not only the extra power but the instant power are great offroad.
with stock gearing they lick the bag. but keep the happy and they work well for you. nothing quite beats 7600rpm on a greassy hillclimb, grabbing next gear and it will pull straight up to the high revs again.

the only real issue is if they get hot, they hate life in a big way.
Author:  UBZ [ Mon May 28, 2012 4:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
I have a MK1 Gti in my 85 NT .
3.9 diffs , 4.16 Gears , 31" Tyres.

I love it to bits , so so so much fun to drive .
Will crawl along fine and lights up awesome .

if I did it agian I would go with 4.9 gears for slightly lower gearing on the rocks.

take one for a drive .....
Author:  mrgtt34 [ Mon May 28, 2012 5:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
jonno_racing wrote:
Daz7 wrote:
Thanks, have searched quite a bit over the weekend but found lots of talk on the conversion but not a lot of real world use feedback (especially when geared).

I think most of the negative info written about the gti is either from people with no real idea or experiance on the matter.
if you are happy to crawl along at no lower than 1500rpm+ the benifits of not only the extra power but the instant power are great offroad.
with stock gearing they lick the bag. but keep the happy and they work well for you. nothing quite beats 7600rpm on a greassy hillclimb, grabbing next gear and it will pull straight up to the high revs again.

the only real issue is if they get hot, they hate life in a big way.


They sound like nothing else my limiter is at 8600 and it gets there real fast on the other side you can still drive them nice and easy. There a very happy little engine. Havent heated mine up yet hope to keep it that way
Author:  Daz7 [ Tue May 29, 2012 9:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
[quote="jonno_racing"the only real issue is if they get hot, they hate life in a big way.[/quote]

Just to clarify - Do they run hotter than the single cam 1300 or are you just saying that they don't like to overheat?
Author:  BlueSuzy [ Tue May 29, 2012 10:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
With a g16b, You don't have to go a vit box.

I like the sierra box. Small, Light and easy to take out. Only needs an adaptor plate to the G16
I think 1 main reason people change it is for the bigger clutch. I had a stock clutch in mine. Only time it slipped was when it was hot, in mud.
I never had a problem with my stock gearbox. Thats why im running one in my lwb now.


My swb was Baleno g16b, 6.5's, 3.7diffs, Rear was welded, 32x12.5s. I love rock and drove it to work whenever i could. I used to go through diffs, but never the gbox.
Author:  jonno_racing [ Tue May 29, 2012 1:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
Daz7 wrote:
[quote="jonno_racing"the only real issue is if they get hot, they hate life in a big way.


Just to clarify - Do they run hotter than the single cam 1300 or are you just saying that they don't like to overheat?[/quote]
nope, I think it run about the same temp, overheating is when it will go wrong.
Author:  sogone [ Tue May 29, 2012 1:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
Building a super charged GTI motor for my new Lwb.
Author:  mrgtt34 [ Tue May 29, 2012 4:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
sogone wrote:
Building a super charged GTI motor for my new Lwb.


I recon that would be nice. What charger you planing?
Author:  Macca52 [ Tue May 29, 2012 8:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
Mine is running GTI with 5.14 gears and 3.9 diffs with 31s and I think it is the perfect combo. Responsive on the highway, lots of control for steep descents and climbs and I don't see any need for more power.
Author:  SierraDan [ Tue May 29, 2012 9:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
5.14's and 3.9's was sweet with a G13BA, would be double sweet with a G13B
Author:  Bennyzarb [ Tue May 29, 2012 10:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
Mate I have a 92 Sierra gti powered with 33s and 6.5s if you want I can take you for a drive and show you what she has ;)
Author:  Bennyzarb [ Tue May 29, 2012 10:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
Bennyzarb wrote:
Mate I have a 92 Sierra gti powered with 33s and 6.5s if you want I can take you for a drive and show you what she has ;)

It is the best I love it we tested the difference the other day between these motors the 1.6 was a bit more touqey but the gti was a Realy fast engine my gti v a vit/balino in a race I'm quite shaw I would smash them lol :deadhorse:
But it all depends on what you drive if you love mud or sand go gti if you love rock go vit but there wasn't much between the engines :peaceout:
Author:  BlueSuzy [ Wed May 30, 2012 1:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
How shore?

You need 2 cars exactly the same except for engines. Same year, same k's, same gearing, same tyres, same drivers. Impossible.

A G16b has more power. Just doesnt sound full sick. A 2.5" pipe with pod filter would fix this.
Author:  SierraDan [ Wed May 30, 2012 1:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
You don't have any idea or experience on the matter of GTi engines. Thay r00l
Author:  BlueSuzy [ Wed May 30, 2012 1:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
SierraDan wrote:
You don't have any idea or experience on the matter of GTi engines. Thay r00l



Sorry Beiber.
Author:  SierraDan [ Wed May 30, 2012 1:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
BlueSuzy wrote:
SierraDan wrote:
You don't have any idea or experience on the matter of GTi engines. Thay r00l



Sorry Beiber.

That's okay Timmy pompoms
Author:  rockafella [ Sun Jun 10, 2012 9:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
hey guys sorry to sound like a noob but i am lol i was just wondering if i could get advice about what gearing and diff and tc stuff id need to do to my zook
Here goes (keep in mind im a noob )
Firstly i have looked over this forum for hours on end and still cant seem to understand (if some one can give me laymens terms explination that would be great)
Ok well i have recently just done a conversion in my 92 suzuki sierra wt and have put in a gti caultis tin cam high compression motor in it
i was going to do a turbo as well but was informed that it wold end up costing me more money in the long run with diffs and boxs that would end up blown so no turbo
any way what i want to know is what and whre and what will it cost me to get it to drive right as in gearing properly
i find it drives with alot of get up and go but still dosnt fell right and was informd to gear it right and will be alot better (i dont understand what this means)
NOw im just your average noobie to the 4x4 scean and dont plan on climbing rocks or anything like that just want it to be my every day driver that goes great on the hwy and can go offroad reasonably well nothing to extreme just to go places in the bush for hunting and fishin g and general exploring haveing fun with my mates
Dont get me wrong i do love some of the things i have seen pics of you guys doing but thats abiot out of my league for now and just want to enjoy the average mans out doors 4x4ing for now to learn
I find now i get upto speed really quickly but i still have the same problem in 5th that i had with the original motor and thats it lose's alot of powere on any incline at all
sorry for the long type up and my bad grammer and puntchuation but it wold be good to get this advice and info

Cheers
Author:  sogone [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
What size tires are ya running?
Author:  rockafella [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
at the moment im running standard but plan on running 30's to 31's by 10.5 just waiting on tax time to get the cash up lol

cheers
Author:  oozuk [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
Daz7 wrote:
I really have to do the vit box too or go auto as it appears the G13B gearbox can't take that much torque constantly.


Who fed you that misinformation ? the G13 sierra box can take a pounding, it's small and lite and you already have one so you might as well use it. Example

I have owned a few sierra's over the years and i have in the past stripped an input shaft gear on a sierra G13 twice in my first swb sierra but let me explain how,
I was running a Carby G16A with high compression, big cam, head work, balanced, ect ect i had 4:1.9 crawler gears, 3.9 diff gears running ratchet lockers front and rear on 31's
it was a great package but the ratchet "lockrite/spartin" lockers are brutal on the drivetrain if your a hard driver, and back then i was very hard on the car, i would do 6000rpm launches in 4Lo at the club events and this eventually took it's toll and stripped the input shafts. I switched to a rear Air locker and never lunched another gearbox again.

Now at the other end of the scale I am now running a Turbocharged G16B with moderate horsepower with an excedy HD clutch feeding a STD G13 sierra Gearbox :shocked:
I'm running 4.19 transfer gears and 4.6 diff gears on 33" tires.
Now with all that torque i split a transfer case in Half !! I have no rectified this with new gears-rocktoy ring and a mighty kong transfer cradle holding it all togther.
and with all the abuse that this new ute (OOZUK) gets the gearbox doesn't give me any trouble.

the only complaint i have with the G13 sierra gearbox is the poor shifter hat design, if you get on a steep enough hill all your gearbox oil try's to escape out the rear of the box past the gearstick bush and boot.

Now before anybody asks "if you think the G13 gearboxes are soo good then why are you going to an AW4 auto" in usual Auszookers smartass fashion,
The reason i am doing this is that i would like a better crawl ratio in 1st low and still try to maintain good road speed without the engine reving its arse out @100km/hr which i will suffer if i go 6.5's with my drivetrain.
Plus i'm getting older and my driving style is changing (when ever i do go for a drive) and i like the smooth (axle friendly) power that an auto delivers when crawling.
Author:  masterA [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 2:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
I've got a 92 tintop sierra with a GTi running 3.7 standard diffs with 4.9 reduction on 30" Bighorns and it sits on 3,400 rpm at 100km/h
I also have a Maruti with 4.1 diffs, 1L transfer and 31's with lockrights but i can't tell you the revs at 100km/h as it currently doesn't have a tacho (getting one installed sometime this week hopefully)
The 1L transfer isn't really suitable for 31's and im looking at getting 5.14's for it
I've just dropped the 4.9 case out of the tintop to see how well it'll do so hopefully get to drive it this/next week
I think it'll be a great setup especially since the diff's are 4.1's

The 4.9's are awsome and i usually start off in 2nd low and get to use 3rd & 4th most of the time on hills etc
The advantage of being able to use 4th gear is that it's 1:1 and direct link so less chance of breaking your gearbox

IMHO they're both a fantastic setup especially if you're going to be doing alot of daily driving

In saying that, both conversions G16B and the GTi are awsome....just depends what you want

Personally, torque wasn't too much of an issue for me as we don't have too many rocks here in WA and i sorted that out with gearing.... i wanted to rev past the 5,500 redline of the G16B

Each to their own, but once you drive a GTi (with gearing) it'll be hard to convince you to go back to a G16B :)



rockafella - i've got 30's on 4.9 gears and it's awsome. If you're planning on doing alot of crawling then maybe 5.14 would be more suitable
Author:  jonno_racing [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
masterA wrote:
Each to their own, but once you drive a GTi (with gearing) it'll be hard to convince you to go back to a G16B :)

X2
there just more "fun"
Author:  JrZook [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
masterA wrote:
Personally, torque wasn't too much of an issue for me as we don't have too many rocks here in WA and i sorted that out with gearing.... i wanted to rev past the 6,500 redline of the G16B

:wink:
Author:  abclarke [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
Awww i want a gti now :(
Author:  matty_wall [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
abclarke wrote:
Awww i want a gti now :(


Buy the bits and ill help you install it :wink:
Author:  rockafella [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: GTI Engine with gears
ok heres the next stupid noob questions lol
Ok so firstly when you say 4.9 gearing you mean as in diff gears right ? (are you sure 3.9 isnt better)
Also will it be good for say 31-32's also and where would i find or look to buy these
with out it costing me a small sheep station

Cheers
Rockafella
Page 1 of 2 All times are UTC + 9:30 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
https://www.phpbb.com/