auszookers.com :: View topic - Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???

Thanks for the input guys..

Didnt really expect lengthy answers but they are very much appreciated. Thought it was silly, but hey, no question is a stupid question.
The spacers are just laying around so i thought id see if i could put them to some use.. but it seems like more trouble than its worth. Might put them up for sale.

Im not as serious about my zook like most of you on here are, but i do enjoy it, just not to the extent that id go spending another couple of grand on a bigger lift, tyres, gearing etc. My intentions were a budget build to get me off the tar and onto the dirt for a camp, fish etc.. and i suppose its doing just fine for what it is.
I will fab up a transfer case skid and fuel tank skid plate to prevent any more deep gashes in my fuel tank and bending the transfer cross member anymore.

thanks again guys.

here's what i call my little piece of shit.. haha.

Author:	ms1991 [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 10:11 am ]
Post subject:	Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
Got some 50mm, 30mm and 25mm coil spacers lying around and as im fixing my bumpstop atm was thinking of throwing in the 50mm on the rear and 25's on the front... just for shits and giggles whilst im working on the car.. already have dobinison 2" struts/springs/shocks and 2" BL. if i decided to keep it with the 6" lift.. what would need attending to? diff drop brackets ofcourse..brake lines? Need a bit more clearance, just got back from doing blue rag range tk, briggs bluff, crooked crk etc in the high country and was having some clearance issues.. so am i being silly or should i just do it and see what happens??

Author:	Gwagensteve [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 10:41 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
No, you're being silly. I'll ignore for the moment that the rear driveshaft will be close to falling out of the transfer and likely vibrate like a mofo, that the rear A arm will be close to maxed out, the rear arms will be at such s steep angle the axle will be swung forward, putting the springs into a funky arch and likely causing them to rub on the coil mounts on the chassis, the front CV's will be at terrible angles even with a diff drop, you'll have stuff all droop in the front end which will make the car feel choppy and nervous on and off road, and you are likely to have uncorrectable camber issues, even with two bolts in each strut. some of these might be an issue, some might not, and they can all be worked around with time, money and perseverance... but, Putting all that aside, where was your clearance problem? were you getting caught up on the front crossmember? What were you getting hung up on, water bars? rocks in the bottom of the river crossings? Ruts? Could you avoid this with more careful line choice? The problem as I see it is that you can lift the car forever and you'll eventually still find something it will hang up on, but every time you lift the car you add compromise to its performance - sure, you can drive over a water bar square without hanging up, but 2km down the track where you have to inch around a fallen tree you're now much more nervous that it's going to fall over. It's not possible to build a car that won't have a clearance issue somewhere. I'm rocking shaved suzuki diffs and 35's and I'm still dragging my diffs on stuff and getting stuck - it's just not practical to build a car with more diff clearance than I'm running (in my opinion, for my terrain) At around a 2" lift, you should find the front end i slightly higher than the rear diff. Cranking more lift in the front will just highlight that the back end is where your real clearance problem is, and that's all about tyre size. Steve.

Author:	christover1 [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 11:27 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
It can be done, but problems need solving, you can't just stick them in without thought. All mods have a trade off of some kind. Spend money, or do work, and lose some function/benefits to gain others Have a look at what I did to solve some issues with my LWB Vit in my build thread. viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9990 Plus others build threads, too.

Author:	vitzookman [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:44 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
do it all the mod shops seam to have parts to fix any issues but dont expect it to be a cheap lift

Author:	atari4x4 [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:52 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
bwhahaha nice advice ODA what are your suggestions for CV's & long travel struts to suit 4" of lift

auszookers.com https://auszookers.com/forum/

Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift??? https://auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=38128	Page 1 of 1

Author:	Gwagensteve [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:37 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
One of the big problems as far as I can see with increased lift height on vitaras is that the total angle the CV's experience. Diff drop brackets help, to be sure, but more angle on the CV's is always worse than less angle. That's true all the time, regardless of how close they are to falling apart at full droop/full lock. If nothing else, more angle on CV's equals shorter boot life, but it's also sapping power, and flogging out the CV's earlier. That's true even if overall droop has been limited to prevent the CV's falling apart. The only reason the tall IFS lifts are possible on the vitara is because suzuki never included a rebound stop in their IFS to prevent the CV's falling apart. Every other 4WD IFS design I'm aware of has a rebound stop to prevent this nonsense of stacking stuff together and spacing everything down for maximum hektikness. Steve.

Author:	christover1 [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:40 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
On another note, I don't think the dobinsons springs give 2" of lift, so 6" lift is not what you'll get. In a nut shell, spring spacers cause loss of down travel, and as Steve pointed out, it will lose off road prowess, by lifting wheels all the time. I solved this on the rear by moving lower shock mount down 50mm and adding bumpstop extensions. Thus having stock Old Man Emu suspension travel, just moved down 50mm. Mismatched travel of shock and spring can damage shock, if it bottoms out before bumpstop is reached. Coil spring can get undue wear from over compression, I think its called coil binding? In down mode, need shock to stop travel, before coil spring can fall out. The front was solved with bumpstop extensions, and reposition of top strut mount (there are various ways ro achieve that.) I fitted diff drop brackets so my cv's explode less often. My cv angles are close to stock OME angles. A arm on rear causes issues with lift, because the further it drops down, the angle gets more vertical. This puts the suspenson travel into wrong movements,( cycling?) Also it makes ya brake bias valve think theres no weight on rear suspension, so it lessens the braking on rear. There are easy fixes for that, to be found on forum. I say do it, but with eyes open, research and thought.

Author:	shep [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:48 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
I had a lwb vit with about that much lift. Thankfully I just bought it as a parts car as it was a terrible handling thing. Seriously it was the worst steering car I have ever driven.

Author:	vitzookman [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:06 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
atari4x4 wrote: bwhahaha nice advice ODA what are your suggestions for CV's & long travel struts to suit 4" of lift If he wants to have some fun then let him, there is a white Vit lwb here with a 3inch calmini lift and a body lift. The back could go another inch and a couple on here claim to have 4inch lift in the front of there GVs I don't see you jumping up and down as to why they should not do it. I did not jump straight in and so NO, let him have his fun and as I said it won't be a cheap mod.

Author:	DarkHorse [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 7:21 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
There are several of us running the 3" Cal lift and body lifts, none of us have not had to do other stuff to make it work. The Calmini kit includes fixes (bandaid maybe, but at least something) including longer control arms and a heim joint in the rear, diff drops and altered arms up front. These deal with some of the issues raised by throwing out the geometry that far, but CVs for example are still almost always the weak point. Without them you're asking for trouble. Increasing spring height (or spacing) doesn't just raise everything vertically. Suspension works in arcs, as determined by the control arm mounts on the chassis. As the rear axle moves down relative to the chassis it also moves forward, and rolls/tilts backwards. This why long shocks sold with long springs often foul on the brake lines, and why springs will banana in weird ways because the top and bottom mounts are no longer lined up. At the front the arc is lattitudinal to the car - as the spring pushes the hub down it also moves inboard and rolls, hence the camber issues Steve referred to above, and more spring bananas. With three mount points on both the strut and the knuckle there is only so much camber adjustment you can do without drastically modifying the strut, so you get a very quick steering but unpredictable front that eats tyres and bearings. Even diff drops are part of an arc - the further you drop the further the front tilts forward, and the higher the pinion and driveshaft lift as the diff pivots around the crossmember. As for the OP - yeah, you being silly. Spacers are not a solution to lift/clearance issues. The only way to increase diff clearance is bigger tyres or shaving diffs. If it's sill clearance, look at sliders. If it's tyres vs body clearance, get chopping. Tyres vs chassis either steering stops or offset.

Author:	atari4x4 [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 7:40 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
vitzookman wrote: atari4x4 wrote: bwhahaha nice advice ODA what are your suggestions for CV's & long travel struts to suit 4" of lift I don't see you jumping up and down as to why they should not do it. the reason why i didn't bother with this one is as per the what OP stated, it's a silly idea. especially trying to achieve it with mixed & matched bits & pieces. plus it all seems pretty pointless to me going for a larger lift if he's not trying to fit larger tyres.

Author:	ms1991 [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 7:43 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
Thanks for the input guys.. Didnt really expect lengthy answers but they are very much appreciated. Thought it was silly, but hey, no question is a stupid question. The spacers are just laying around so i thought id see if i could put them to some use.. but it seems like more trouble than its worth. Might put them up for sale. Im not as serious about my zook like most of you on here are, but i do enjoy it, just not to the extent that id go spending another couple of grand on a bigger lift, tyres, gearing etc. My intentions were a budget build to get me off the tar and onto the dirt for a camp, fish etc.. and i suppose its doing just fine for what it is. I will fab up a transfer case skid and fuel tank skid plate to prevent any more deep gashes in my fuel tank and bending the transfer cross member anymore. thanks again guys. here's what i call my little piece of shit.. haha.

Author:	christover1 [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 7:46 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
Mine improved heaps off road after fitting skid pans. It now slides over stuff that it used to hang up on. Protects delicate crossmembers, too.

Author:	Gwagensteve [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 7:50 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
I just don't get why/where clearance is your issue. Your car has plenty of clearance to drive anything I've ever seen in the high county. That doesn't mean you can take any line on any track though, but as I've pointed out, there's no end to the process (and cost) if you want that. As per christover's comment - if you're hanging up on the front crossmember, it's time for a skidplate, not more lift. I wouldn't be lifting your car any more than it is now - seems plenty tall to me. Steve.

Page 1 of 1	All times are UTC + 9:30 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group https://www.phpbb.com/

Author:	Built4thrashing [ Sun Jan 06, 2013 8:28 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
ms1991 wrote: Thanks for the input guys.. Didnt really expect lengthy answers but they are very much appreciated. Thought it was silly, but hey, no question is a stupid question. The spacers are just laying around so i thought id see if i could put them to some use.. but it seems like more trouble than its worth. Might put them up for sale. Im not as serious about my zook like most of you on here are, but i do enjoy it, just not to the extent that id go spending another couple of grand on a bigger lift, tyres, gearing etc. My intentions were a budget build to get me off the tar and onto the dirt for a camp, fish etc.. and i suppose its doing just fine for what it is. I will fab up a transfer case skid and fuel tank skid plate to prevent any more deep gashes in my fuel tank and bending the transfer cross member anymore. thanks again guys. here's what i call my little piece of shit.. haha. No need to fab up a t/case skid plate as i still have a couple from when i got them made going cheap. Pm me and ill give you the details.

Author:	Bucketload [ Thu Jan 10, 2013 12:44 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Any Vits Running 4"suspension lift and 2" body lift???
Does running spacers with Dobinson’s (say 30mm spacers, guessing Dobinson’s give 35-40mm lift) without any body lift present major issues. I am just trying to work out the options shy of a Cal 3” kit?