bent front axle? massive castor and draglink issues?
sure the kingpin/main wheel bearings are ok?
any newer pics?
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| Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. https://auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=44937 |
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| Author: | whincup [ Mon Feb 03, 2014 12:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
Currently, my front wheels when viewed from the front of the car look like \---/ not quite that bad but its pretty bad. seems to be no play in the bearings, what else can cause this? i know its not adjustable, more wanting to know if theres anything that can break/wear to cause this? or is it just a case of replace the housing & knuckles? it has been this way for a little while and slowly getting worse, but driving the car yesterday it's just started severe death wobbles, and at the same time it's started pulling to the left much harder than normal, to the point where im holding the steering wheel about 45 degrees more to the right to maintain going straight. how it feels is as though the front left tire is flat. 2 days before it started doing this, i drove from rockhampton to brisbane drama free, other than what feels like possible wheels being unbalanced and minor wandering/pulling to the left, nowhere near enough to concern me. where should i start looking? bearings and tie rods appear fine. could the excessive positive camber & toe in account for it? |
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| Author: | Jezza86 [ Mon Feb 03, 2014 2:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
bent front axle? massive castor and draglink issues? sure the kingpin/main wheel bearings are ok? any newer pics?
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| Author: | whincup [ Mon Feb 03, 2014 2:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
draglink/tierod look straight to me and i cant see any play in them. jacking up the front end, grab top and bottom of tire and theres no play so i think bearings and kingpins are fine, is that how kingpins are checked? other than pulling them out. i would think if it was a bent axle i'd end up with negative camber, but i dont know how this stuff works. i'll get a photo shortly... going to send it in for a wheel alignment Wednesday and get some figures of how bad it is... |
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| Author: | Jezza86 [ Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
yeh you'd expect -ive all i can think of is to duct tape some even sized blocks to a spirit level and see if the rims are pointing vertical to be sure its not a optical illusion. |
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| Author: | whincup [ Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
my brothers a plasterer, i borrowed his massive T square to measure it and its definitely got camber. really cant see the camber here, but pictures are as the car sits... couldnt get a flat bit of ground, this is facing downhill but its flat left-right. second is to compare camber vs the rear which is flat, passenger side is slightly worse. third photo of the tire on the front was originally my spare and is only about 5000km old, shows how bad the outer wear is. similar wear on other side... |
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| Author: | fordem [ Mon Feb 03, 2014 10:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
The only way you'll get camber on a live axle vehicle is if something is bent - tire wear is not a good indicator - incorrect toe will give misleading results. |
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| Author: | Gwagensteve [ Tue Feb 04, 2014 6:33 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
Long shackles reduce caster. Inadequate caster and toe in will provide positive camber. I'd get a proper alignment done, ditch the long shackles (and/or add caster shims) and then see how the camber looks. Steve. |
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| Author: | whincup [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 10:48 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
Got a balance & alignment done. There was 30mm toe in, and apparently both the fronts tires are 'separated' from overheating... I don't understand exactly what that means but i was getting new tires friday anyway, i just have to drive brisbane to rockhampton like that. Wobbles are much better but not completely gone Brisbane bob janes cant beat $360 for a 31" km2, rockhampton has them $295. No complaints! |
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| Author: | Jezza86 [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
http://www.tyretrader.com.au/bfg-31x10. ... rt=pd.name 224.00 a tire, shipping can be exxy to rocky, ITT is located in sydney i think. |
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| Author: | Gwagensteve [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
I can't believe a car that weighs less than a single 31" tyre can support can overheat a tyre badly enough to damage it. I call bs on that one. As for wobbles, how was your caster? How is your kingpin bearing starting torque? Steve. |
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| Author: | JrZook [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:16 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
Gwagensteve wrote: I can't believe a car that weighs less than a single 31" tyre can support can overheat a tyre badly enough to damage it. Not even with a shit load of toe, scrubbing them like mad, at highway speeds for extended periods? |
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| Author: | whincup [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
Gwagensteve wrote: I can't believe a car that weighs less than a single 31" tyre can support can overheat a tyre badly enough to damage it. I call bs on that one. As for wobbles, how was your caster? How is your kingpin bearing starting torque? Steve. i'll take it to an actual suspension workshop to have caster/camber measured when i get home. same with kingpins, i have all the tools at home, just don't have whats needed to check it here. but the pictured tire there has only done about 5000-10,000km, could alignment far enough out to wear a tire that quick account for that sort of heat? car weighs in at about 1.3 ton (still light but heavy by suzuki standards), and the tires are old enough they've started getting small cracks in the rubber. fixed the pulling to the left. rear left tire was half of the rear right pressure. good combo on a minispool 
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| Author: | whincup [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
JrZook wrote: Gwagensteve wrote: I can't believe a car that weighs less than a single 31" tyre can support can overheat a tyre badly enough to damage it. Not even with a shit load of toe, scrubbing them like mad, at highway speeds for extended periods? and it did do 650km with only one quick stop, sitting 110km/h most of the way. issues didnt start until after that... |
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| Author: | Gwagensteve [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 12:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
JrZook wrote: Gwagensteve wrote: I can't believe a car that weighs less than a single 31" tyre can support can overheat a tyre badly enough to damage it. Not even with a shit load of toe, scrubbing them like mad, at highway speeds for extended periods? No, I really don't think so. Friction at the tread face does not equal heat in the carcass. Steve. |
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| Author: | whincup [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 3:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
Having driven it again, im convinced theres play somewhere... The wobble feels more of a knock in the steering wheel. I'll have to have another look into it. Also noticed the gearstick wobbling about the same rate, probably just as a result... I did just install power steering 3 weeks ago, and couldnt find a way to refit the steering damper so it could be an issue with the steering box, or an issue thats long been masked by the damper. Just saw bob jane did give a copy of alignment specs, attached to the receipt. Can anyone tell me or link what factory specs are?? Left camber is now 0.8, right is -0.1 Left caster is now 2.9, right is 2.3 How can it vary left to right on a solid axle?? |
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| Author: | Blkfxx [ Wed Feb 05, 2014 3:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
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| Author: | whincup [ Fri Feb 07, 2014 6:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
so today i got motivated and removed the kingpin shims from the passengers side, drivers side didnt have any. wobbles almost completely gone! still a bad wobble 60-80km/h, but nothing on what it was. kingpin stank of diff oil though so i'll be rebuilding all of that next week... |
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| Author: | KEENSY85 [ Mon Feb 10, 2014 6:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
If ur front springs have sunk a little (ie gone a bit flat) ur castor will be out if it goes to far out, it rolls ur diff around the wrong way and then it gives u the wrong camber . Normel symptoms are the steering loose feeling ,car feels as if it's wants to randomly jump off the road ,sensitive to cross winds . If u get ur caster checked it's probably out .or ur steering box might have to much play. Hope that helps |
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| Author: | whincup [ Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
yeah i posted the camber and caster angles a few posts up, i think the toe in was causing the bad camber when turning... camber is still a degree out on drivers side, same with the caster. not sure if its worth correcting only one degree... hard to say if the steering feels loose, as i just fitted power steering. before that i would most definitely have felt any tiny difference. either way i've ordered new wheel bearing & swivel hub kit, as well as new kingpins. found a small amount of play in the drag link to pitman arm joint, so got a new drag link coming too. can anyone tell me where to get kingpin shims?? |
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| Author: | JrZook [ Mon Feb 10, 2014 1:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
KEENSY85 wrote: If ur front springs have sunk a little (ie gone a bit flat) ur castor will be out if it goes to far out, it rolls ur diff around the wrong way and then it gives u the wrong camber . Normel symptoms are the steering loose feeling ,car feels as if it's wants to randomly jump off the road ,sensitive to cross winds . If u get ur caster checked it's probably out .or ur steering box might have to much play. Hope that helps ?? If your springs are flat the caster angle will actually improve slightly due to the increase in shackle angle and the responding reduction in shackle height. This will improve steering correction and straight line holding abilities.... |
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| Author: | KEENSY85 [ Mon Feb 10, 2014 3:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
JrZook wrote: KEENSY85 wrote: If ur front springs have sunk a little (ie gone a bit flat) ur castor will be out if it goes to far out, it rolls ur diff around the wrong way and then it gives u the wrong camber . Normel symptoms are the steering loose feeling ,car feels as if it's wants to randomly jump off the road ,sensitive to cross winds . If u get ur caster checked it's probably out .or ur steering box might have to much play. Hope that helps ?? If your springs are flat the caster angle will actually improve slightly due to the increase in shackle angle and the responding reduction in shackle height. This will improve steering correction and straight line holding abilities.... Depends how flat mate :/ if it goes to flat the diff rolls the other way |
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| Author: | Gwagensteve [ Mon Feb 10, 2014 5:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
No, I'm with jr. Caster won't change with leaf spring sag. |
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| Author: | KEENSY85 [ Mon Feb 10, 2014 7:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Positive Camber?? & death wobble questions. |
That's just what I was told at work my bad lol |
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