I'm going to say after running 31's on my 1.3 go for some gears bite the bullet and just do it like I've just done .
Can't tell you how they go yet as I haven't got em in haha , also got a cheap spartan locker for safe measures
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| Sierra reduction gears alternative ? https://auszookers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=45467 |
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| Author: | jay851 [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 4:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
I've got a 92 sierra It's got 4" lift and 31" muddies Reduction gears have been recommended but I can't afford them ATM, is there an alternative for them? Or just little tricks and tips to handle better? Cheers |
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| Author: | alien [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 5:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Nothings going to beat a set of 5.14 or 6.5 tcase gears and some bracing of the transfer mounts. Its also the cheapest method of addressing gearing, as diff gears aren't all that cheap, nor do they help you out with a further reduction of low range. so far as making it easier on the car, you could run higher tyre pressures so it rolls a bit easier, but it'll be a rough ride. |
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| Author: | jay851 [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 5:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
I'm going to have to hold off the t case gears I will hopefully eventually get some tho I will try the tyre pressure, what psi do you recommend? Also how long do you think I can go untill I break something?? |
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| Author: | shep [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Stock tyres is the cheapest way to fix your gearing issues |
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| Author: | alien [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
^^ what Shep said. You won't break anything that you wouldn't otherwise break with gearing - you're just going to burn through your clutch WAY faster... you're also putting more load on the motor but you can fix that by just revving it harder and never using 5th gear (you probably can't use it on any sort of incline or into a headwind at the moment anyway). Offroad you're more likely to break something because you literally can't go any slower without stalling - so instead you're hitting everything way faster than you need to and bouncing all over the place out of control =) Tyre pressures aren't going to help a ton - the more you inflate them the taller the tyre gets and the worse the gearing - but it will help with rolling resistance to a degree (maybe you can test it and report back?) 20-25psi in the front and 18-22psi in the back is "normal" for 31's on a sierra on the road... if you want to test high pressures, go for 35psi front and rear and just "see what happens" - and let us know the difference... my bet is you'll feel need to buy a kidney belt =) |
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| Author: | sideways [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
1l transfer case (12% lower) or 4.1 diff gears from a WT Maruti or Jimny rear (10% lower) are cheaper, but just do it properly and get proper gears. Without lower gearing there's 0 point in having 31s, aside from looking cool. WTs aren't even geared low enough for technical stuff with stock tyres, let alone larger ones. |
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| Author: | jay851 [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Would you recommend 235/75 untill I get money to do it properly? They just look so small with 4" |
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| Author: | sideways [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
I'd recommend pulling the lift out, selling it and using that money to buy gears. Is it spring over axle? |
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| Author: | jay851 [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Nah it's 2" body, 2" leaf and it's stock leaf under |
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| Author: | MrRocky [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 7:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
sideways wrote: Without lower gearing there's 0 point in having 31s, aside from looking cool . That is a bold statement, internet mechanics and owning a few junkers hardly qualifys you arise at such conclusions. Have you ever owned a sierra with an aftermarket gearset ? (1ltr gear doesnt count) A sierra on 31"s in particular skinny 31"s (245/75r16) is just as capable as a geared sierra on the same. Sure you might burn a bit more clutch but the geared car will go no further than the ungeared car in 99.9% of circumstances. It is only when lockers are involved that having gears to go with the traction makes the biggest difference. |
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| Author: | alien [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 7:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
but without constantly slipping the clutch the sierra on 31's is going about 20% faster for any given gear than the one on stock tyres - so as well as the clutch cooking there's far more risk of banging into something you didnt mean to, or bouncing it harder and breaking/bending something. 96coily has been on 30's with no gearing for like - forever... he's VERY good at clutching (and smoking up said clutch) - he also has some HUGE dents on the front corners from going too fast and bouncing into things =) |
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| Author: | MrRocky [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 8:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
To be perfectly honest a sierra unlocked isnt terribly capable in serious scenarios. Having owned and driven many sierras geared and ungeared i believe that a a stock sierra all be it with bad gearing allows you to keep up momentum even more momentum than you should to bounce and bump over obstacles. However with a 6:5 gearset will struggle to maintain the momentum required unlocked to get over an obstacle generally speaking the geared car will wind up sitting there spinning tyres where the ungeared car carries enough momentum to get through even with a bit of clutch smoke. I just dont see how a noob in my perspective giving advice that there is zero point in putting 31"s on a sierra is very correct statement when many guys make do and are alot more capable than they would be on lesser tyres |
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| Author: | alien [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 8:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
i agree with that... but the OP did ask how long before something breaks - and you have to admit that you're more likely to break something on 31's than stock tyres, geared or not =) |
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| Author: | MrRocky [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 8:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Not really only the clutch and even then you should get a couple years out of a stock one. The driveline holds up pretty well until lockers come into the equation. I will admit you are more likely to wind up in a pecarious situation and body damage tends to happen sooner rather than later. I ran 235/85r16 (32"s) on my maruti recently with stock gearing unlocked and although not ideal still was fine for all but the hardcore stuff in perth for 12 months. |
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| Author: | rockcrawlerdude [ Sat Mar 15, 2014 10:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
I got 31's in my LWB, twin locked and 1.6, no really issues until technical stuff. Still it barly makes 100 kms on the freeway. |
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| Author: | 3cyl [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 5:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Nobody gets far around our tracks with 31s on a Sierra if they don't have gears. Not saying you need 6.5s though, there are a few options, a 1 litre transfer case would help minimize the clutch stink for the less technical stuff and NT diffs are a little lower than WT. If you buy 2 diffs and a transfer at your local wrecker though it wouldn't be much cheaper than gears straight from Lowrange in the USA, a lot more effort and nowhere near as effective. |
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| Author: | PurpleZOOK [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 6:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
I'm going to say after running 31's on my 1.3 go for some gears bite the bullet and just do it like I've just done . Can't tell you how they go yet as I haven't got em in haha , also got a cheap spartan locker for safe measures .
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| Author: | killazook [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 8:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
rockcrawlerdude wrote: I got 31's in my LWB, twin locked and 1.6, no really issues until technical stuff. Still it barly makes 100 kms on the freeway. I guess the 1.6 was the solution for the bigget tyres on your lwb and as much experience as you may have I think alien is right because if you need that momentum you can always hit it with a higher gear but beat way is locked and geared |
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| Author: | rockcrawlerdude [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
killazook wrote: rockcrawlerdude wrote: I got 31's in my LWB, twin locked and 1.6, no really issues until technical stuff. Still it barly makes 100 kms on the freeway. I guess the 1.6 was the solution for the bigget tyres on your lwb and as much experience as you may have I think alien is right because if you need that momentum you can always hit it with a higher gear but beat way is locked and geared Haha I just put the 1.6 in due to shitty 1.3, this was my first car, and because I'm only 16 I can't afford gears right now, but hopefully will when I get my p's. but yeah I wish it was lower so I didn't have to ride the brakes down long hills. |
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| Author: | ZookFan [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
The 1.6 is quite a noticeable improvement over the 1.3..you will love the extra grunt! 
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| Author: | sideways [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 9:59 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
MrRocky wrote: sideways wrote: Without lower gearing there's 0 point in having 31s, aside from looking cool . That is a bold statement, internet mechanics and owning a few junkers hardly qualifys you arise at such conclusions. Have you ever owned a sierra with an aftermarket gearset ? (1ltr gear doesnt count) A sierra on 31"s in particular skinny 31"s (245/75r16) is just as capable as a geared sierra on the same. Sure you might burn a bit more clutch but the geared car will go no further than the ungeared car in 99.9% of circumstances. It is only when lockers are involved that having gears to go with the traction makes the biggest difference. Don't you know how to band wagon?  Nope, but I have had big tyres and no gearing. I found I didn't have the torque to climb steep rocks slowly. I had to hit things fast and I got the dents and broken parts that go with that. If I could crawl I wouldn't have those. Of course, yeah you can slip the hell out of the clutch. That's a shitty solution. The biggest thing for me was that it made the car such a POS to drive on the road. All round, it was more capable on smaller tyres. Big tyres, no gearing is by far the worst mod I've done to a car. The LJ doesn't have the rocks issue because it's geared much lower. It's so much more controllable and I don't have to slip the clutch. I'd still like it geared lower though. Maybe I'm just a noob driver but being able to go slower, having more torque and being able to drive in a much more controlled fashion is going to get anyone further, and with less damage. I agree super low gearing wouldn't be as useful in an unlocked sierra than in a locked one. I also agree that an unlocked Sierra isn't a particularly capable vehicle. My point is more 31s without gearing isn't an effective combo in technical stuff, and what's the point in having 31s if you aren't driving that sort of stuff? They also make the car worse to drive everywhere else, except mud. A Maurti with an EFI motor is geared 25% lower than an SJ70 and has more torque. Hardly comparable. |
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| Author: | MrRocky [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 12:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Was running 32"s on the maruti that measure 33" compared to most others on the market. The best thing about the tyres ive run previously (245/75r16) is that they are skinny and light when compared to the 31x10.5r15's most people run. The difference in weight and rolling friction on the road makes a noticeable benefit over the wider tyres on road and off. 31"s on a sierra will still outdo 30"s/29"s in pretty much most situations bar possibly sand dunes and ultimately result in less panel/undercarridge damage if you can drive due to providing more under diff clearance as well as a buffer on the side to stop the old squashed flare syndrome. Second hand info and advice when you really have no experiance in the matter of gearing just fills noobs heads with rubbish and made up tech |
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| Author: | Gwagensteve [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 1:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
I'll play. When I started playing with Sierras there were no gears available. I ran just over 31's on stock NT gearing and open diffs. Yes, it was more capable than a standard sierra. But it was still pretty terrible. I had to hate the clutch, pinball all over the shop because I had to keep the revs way up, and generally have a hard time. The first time I saw a car with proper low range gears in it my mind was blown. I can't express how much easier gearing makes a car to drive. I'd agree, if you can't afford gears there's no point putting the big tyres on yet. Even though the really only increased damage is to the clutch, driving everything too fast and the effect that has on your confidence is significant. Steve. |
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| Author: | Marko_SJ [ Sun Mar 16, 2014 5:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Gwagensteve wrote: I'll play. When I started playing with Sierras there were no gears available. I ran just over 31's on stock NT gearing and open diffs. Yes, it was more capable than a standard sierra. But it was still pretty terrible. I had to hate the clutch, pinball all over the shop because I had to keep the revs way up, and generally have a hard time. The first time I saw a car with proper low range gears in it my mind was blown. I can't express how much easier gearing makes a car to drive. I'd agree, if you can't afford gears there's no point putting the big tyres on yet. Even though the really only increased damage is to the clutch, driving everything too fast and the effect that has on your confidence is significant. Steve. Thankyou for saying this. ungeared is shit. That is all. |
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| Author: | 5ierra [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 2:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Drop out the BL & sell it. Cut guards to fit wheels. Stop looking for a bullbar and put that towards gears. You should be at around $400 now. That will get you some second hand gears (maybe even in a case if youre lucky). Worst case you are 2/3's of the way to a new set of gears anyway. INB4 dismissive "you dont know what your talking about" thinking. I've owned a bog stock 1.3 wt. A 1.6efi lwb 31's on 5.12 R&P (went to 3.7 R&P 6.5:1 tcase because it was woefull in lowrange), and now own another 1.6efi LWB this time on 32's 3.7 R&P with 6.5:1's again. AFAIC, you do what you want to your sierra. You drive it how you please, mod it how you please and the like. It's your car to do with as you please. BUT I will mention that cutting corners, like going to bigger tires with no gearing, is the road to borken parts, and replacing said parts adds up quickly. Then you end up with a sierra that all broken, no money to fix it or make it stronger. Yes, doing things right takes more money, but your car & wallet will love you for it in the long run. |
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| Author: | MrRocky [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 2:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
What breaks ungeared and unlocked on 31"s ??? |
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| Author: | tanshi [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 2:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
no one is saying it breaks more, short of clutch issues and breakages around having to ram stuff harder. but advising that big tyres work just fine without gearing is just plain false. |
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| Author: | alien [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 4:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Chance of bending diff housings goes up a heap too - due to all the bouncing. This said i think if you're running 31's you should be bracing the housings regardless of whether you're geared, locked or not.. its a lot of weight and leverage either way. |
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| Author: | MrRocky [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 7:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
Not saying 31"s are a fantastic idea ungeared but to say there is zero point in fitting them ungeared is a bit of a false statement. I think the vast majority of sierra drivers start out on 31"s ungeared and then progress with gears,lockers, ect... I would hardly consider braced diffs mandatory with 31"s nor larger tyres. It completely depends on driving style, most of the sierras i drive with in perth do not have braced diffs, the fact is there really isnt anything in perth worthy of a serious amount of armour nor larger tyres than 31"s. The guys around here with all the highly modded cars generally spend there time wheeling with stockers and playing internet mechanics. Iam aware over east has plenty of tracks requiring 34"s or larger and 6:5's as a neccesity, when i offer my opinion i can only relate it to perth tracks and we have 2 hills  and 3 tracks within 1:45mins drive.
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| Author: | Gwagensteve [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 7:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Sierra reduction gears alternative ? |
This side of the country I can't see any point in bracing diffs. I haven't seen a bent front housing, ever. I've seen two broken rear housings from cape york corrugations and a few cracked housings from stupid traction bars and spring overs, but they don't count. Whilst it is possible to drive a stock geared sierra on 31's, I really do think there is zero point from my standpoint. Maybe in sand it's the hot setup, but I won't comment on sand in this instance. Steve. |
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