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UHF and arial recommendations
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Author:  Heideisadog [ Wed Jul 09, 2014 5:38 pm ]
Post subject:  UHF and arial recommendations
Hey all!

I'm going to go and buy a UHF and arial tomorrow and would just like to know what you all use or can recommend to me.
I'm not really one to go for the cheap option "just because it works" I like quality and happy to pay the extra for it.

Also I don't really know what arial to get? What's the go with the big fiberglass ones? And what's the difference in Db's achieve? Should I go higher or lower?

I know this is quite a broad question, but I ask mainly to hear what works and what doesn't for you.

Thanks,
Thomas
Author:  Scrawny [ Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
I, personally, like what GME have to offer. But whatever you get make sure it has 80 channels, not 40.
Author:  Heideisadog [ Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Okay. What's the extra 40 channels do?
Author:  Scrawny [ Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Not much ATM, but eventually they will have a use. The 40 channel radios will slowly be phased out so best to buy an 80 channel unit now
Author:  Scrawny [ Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Remote face or remote mic gives you the option of an easier install. The AE4018 aerial is a good all rounder, someone will post a pretty pic of how the different aerials perform shortly

Image
Author:  Scrawny [ Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Have a search thru the forum, there's been plenty if discussion on this. Here's a pic of aerial gain theory, not the one I was thinking of but still kinda explains it.

Ben_Sierra wrote:
Antenna theory is complex.

The length of an antenna often has more to do with frequency than gain.

Also, antennas acheive gain by focusing the radiation. A higher gain means a narrower beamwidth. On flat terrain a high gain antenna will give you a long range, but on hilly terrain a lower gain antenna will be better, as shown in the image below.

Image
Author:  Jezza86 [ Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
if your in really hilly/ valley country lower Db is better, if your crossing the Nullarbor you want a 9Db
6Db is prety typical/ standard.
flexible aerials that bend in the wind loose their effectiveness. a straight aerial is a powerful focused one and is more reliable, unless you drive through scrub and a branch is going to snap your aerial, then a wire whip may be better

with a 9Db aerial i could get a clear line of sight transmission 48K.
Author:  Jezza86 [ Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
and if your really rich, i know moterolla do a duel UHF VHF with a single handpiece. think we paid 7k for it at work but...
Author:  Scrawny [ Wed Jul 09, 2014 8:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Your average punter has no need for VHF tho
Author:  Heideisadog [ Thu Jul 10, 2014 10:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Great little picture! Thankyou for that!
Think a standard 6db would be good for what I do. Mainly road trips and hunting and that. Every now and then into the mountains but the cars are always fairly close together.
I always see people with 2 arials, can you have a switch between them? Or would they just have two radios?

Yeah no need for that!

Thanks guys!
Author:  Jezza86 [ Thu Jul 10, 2014 10:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
extended phone aerials, uhf + seperate vhf, or relocated standard AM/FM aerials.
Author:  Scrawny [ Thu Jul 10, 2014 11:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Jezza86 wrote:
extended phone aerials, uhf + relocated standard AM/FM aerials.


This is what I run
Author:  Heideisadog [ Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Thanks for all the help guys!
I got a 5db sprung fiberglass arial and a GME TX3100 radio.
Very happy with it and mounting and wiring was very easy!
Author:  Jezza86 [ Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Make sure you trim down excessive aerial cable. Dont just wind it up and stick it under the dash. It drops both send and receive signals which means some signals wont pass the digital sqeltch filter
Author:  bumstein [ Thu Jul 10, 2014 8:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Sorry Jezza, I'm going to have to disagree with you here.

The aerial cable length is no accidental "this should do", the tuning of the aerial is determined by the length of the cable. UHF and radio boffins can correct me, but the tuning is in something like 6 inch lengths. I'm not full bottle on this but my advice is choose a location where the cable wont cause a problem (I have mine neatly in the engine bay above the wheel arch tucked in behind everything) and curl up the excess in a figure 8. Cable tie, and I like to run split conduit over mine to keep it neat and out of the weather.

More or less any UHF will work the same, they have a 5W output and will do the same job. Some UHF's have cool features, different mounts and controls but the aerial is where the real technical variations are.

Having said that I know heaps of people who have cut their cables down and they don't notice a difference. You would probably need to do a side by side comparison to see the difference!!

Now I've posted on the subject of UHF's before and there were some pretty hotly contested opinions. This is my opinion but I'm happy that you have yours, even if it's not the same as mine :)

Also, admittedly I can be wrong
Author:  Jezza86 [ Thu Jul 10, 2014 8:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
5 w is the maximum legal broadcast wattage for consumer level stuff.
trimming coaxial is fine as long as you solder the fittings back on afterwards. no crimping here.
the only time you cant trim is when your using a tiny pretuned POS 0-2 db aerial that uses some of the cable length as the aerial. these are typically less then 30cm tall.
Author:  Heideisadog [ Thu Jul 10, 2014 8:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
I haven't chopped my cable at all. It's in a neat bunch, cable tied under the glovebox. I have the split pipe on the exterior and engine bay cable all the way to the firewall.
Don't really want to chop it if I don't have too... But if you honestly think it'll make a difference I'll look into it more. By the sounds of it, I shouldn't worry for my use...
Author:  Jezza86 [ Thu Jul 10, 2014 9:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
as long as you don't have 5+m of spare cable the difference is marginal.
wrap it so its not in a circle. circles make em fields and therefore interference.
Author:  watermouse [ Thu Jul 10, 2014 9:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Anyone have an opinion on the Icom radios compared to GME?

My last Uniden was very ordinary.
Author:  alien [ Fri Jul 11, 2014 9:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
I'm curious - how many of you actually need a hard mounted UHF with antenna?? For the 4wding I do - my 3W (and now my 5W) hand held have been more than ample, and i can get out of the car with it and spot people from the top / bottom of a hill. They have all the attachments like the CIA style ear piece or a separate mic/speaker like a hard wired job.

What's making you guys decide not to get a good hand held?
Author:  Gwagensteve [ Fri Jul 11, 2014 9:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Flat batteries, poor audio performance, (can't hear them on the move) dropping them in footwells full of water, loosing them, poor range when used in a vehicle or when trying to talk to a vehicle mounted radio.... There's a few.
Author:  Jezza86 [ Fri Jul 11, 2014 9:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
alien wrote:
I'm curious - how many of you actually need a hard mounted UHF with antenna?? For the 4wding I do - my 3W (and now my 5W) hand held have been more than ample, and i can get out of the car with it and spot people from the top / bottom of a hill. They have all the attachments like the CIA style ear piece or a separate mic/speaker like a hard wired job.

What's making you guys decide not to get a good hand held?


because when i see a road train on the horizon i want him to know to stay on the single lane road so i dont get 32 wheels full of rocks turfed at my car.
its also handy on camping trips when your separated from your mates by more then one sand dune
Author:  pete_79 [ Fri Jul 11, 2014 9:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
I had only a hand held for a long time, but after leaving it on the charger at home a few times I decided to throw in a hard mounted unit. I just bought a small GME second hand unit and antenna, it does the job just fine for me.

Still have the handheld in the glove box (when I remember to bring it) for spotting.
Author:  henno [ Fri Jul 11, 2014 10:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Jezza86 wrote:
because when i see a road train on the horizon i want him to know to stay on the single lane road so i dont get 32 wheels full of rocks turfed at my car.


This was an absolute godsend when we drove back to Brisbane from Karratha via the top end.
Author:  atari4x4 [ Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
watermouse wrote:
Anyone have an opinion on the Icom radios compared to GME?

My last Uniden was very ordinary.


the Icom's are milspec & are a step above the consumer grade GME & Uniden's etc. they're not cheap but are rugged & have all the features & more from memory, will probably be the last UHF you buy.

and ^^^ what all they said about handhelds.
Author:  Jezza86 [ Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
ozinflames wrote:
I HAVE BOTH HANDHELD FOR SPOTTING AND CHEAP PPL WHO HAVE NIETHER AND HARD MOUNT FOR GOING BUSH (A LOT OF THE TIME ON MY OWN SO A HANDHELD WOULD NOT SUIT THAT SITUATION

broadcasting on the full 5 watts i see.
Author:  alien [ Fri Jul 11, 2014 2:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
Gwagensteve wrote:
Flat batteries, poor audio performance, (can't hear them on the move) dropping them in footwells full of water, loosing them, poor range when used in a vehicle or when trying to talk to a vehicle mounted radio.... There's a few.


I've not faced any of those issues with my GME 3W and 5W... I've had them in the rain, but not ever dropped into water, though they say they're water proof to some level. Not had issues with range either... but i rarely have the need to send a signal more than 1km or over more than 1 hill.

So far as flat batteries - the GME operate all day and don't drop a bar on the indicator, and they come with car charger adapters too so its a non-issue.

Just my opinion - horses for courses of course... If i was doing long haul drives / touring etc then i totally understand the hard mount unit for increased range etc. But for day / short trips a handheld just makes much more sense to me.
Author:  droverdave [ Fri Jul 11, 2014 3:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
All depends how you use them. I have a handheld as well, but i bought mine before i even had a 4wd, I use it for talking to friends while on the skii fields.....

It does the job, and i only ever communicate with cars basically within sight so the extra power is of no benefit to me. hand helds are way cheaper too, so if you don't have cash then there's nothing wrong with a handheld if it suits your purpose. I would like to buy an in car one though, even though i have rechargeable batteries and a cradle to put it in at home, it always seems to be flat when i want to go out!

I have a GME TX something in my work ute out here in the desert, it does what its supposed to do. Although having the speaker mounted under the dash actually makes it quite muffled i find (the speaker in this one is mounted in the "box" that is separate from the controlls/mic). I think id prefer a separate little speaker mounted on the console somewhere perhaps.

The antenna on my work ute actually snapped the other day....it has a fat bit which turns into a thin bit, the thin bit snapped where it joins the fat bit. too much bouncing around on corrugations. Still appears works alright though!
Author:  bumstein [ Fri Jul 11, 2014 3:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: UHF and arial recommendations
GME have always worked for me..

I had an issue with one of them where a chip had fried.. Took me bloody ages of fluffing around trying to find the problem, eventuall on advise from a clued in AZ'er I emailed GME..

There was a batch that were always going to die and needed to go back for repair. To their credit, one email and a drive to drop it off and they fixed it without delay. Arrived back on my doorstep a few days later!!

To their discredit they didn't seem to make it well known that there was this issue, it was only by chance that a cunning AZer got me to email them..

I still buy GME.. They've been good other than that problem
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