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1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
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Author:  Zachius [ Tue Nov 17, 2009 8:32 pm ]
Post subject:  1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Currently I am in the process of collecting parts for a 1.6 EFI conversion.

I picked up a baleno motor for $800 including the alternator, loom, ecu, starter motor and p/s pump, and it only has 80,000k on the clock (well at least that is what the wrecker said).

I already have BenT's adapter kit.

Would look some advice regarding the following problems:

1.) Fuel tank - I have a custom long range fuel tank (70L). I am unsure if it has a fuel swirl pot in it and AFAIK it uses the standard sierra fuel pickup mounted on the side of the tank(not sure how this works I could be wrong on this, how do I find out whether it is a standard sierra pickup?).

Can I just mount an external EFI high pressure pump and use that with the existing fuel pickup? I am thinking that a vitara fuel pump would not work mounted on the side of a tank.

2.) Airbox - What airboxes have other people used with the baleno intake manifold? At this stage I am thinking that a Baleno airbox might be the way to go. Thoughts??

I have a snorkel (it is broken atm but I will replace it in the future) so the airbox should be able to accommodate that in the future

3.) Speedo: From what I have read I need a old swift or vitara speedo that has VSS. Do I then use the swift or vitara speedo or just change over the VSS components?

4.) Tacho: From what I have read I need to get a tacho from a baleno to have a working tacho.

5.) Exhaust: If I use vitara/jimny extractors will I still need to modify the extractors and/or engine mount? Is there certain extractors that fit better than others, and if so does anyone have part numbers etc.?

6.) Thermostat housing: I would like to route the coolant pipe from the thermostat housing under the intake manifold up to the radiator. Is there any factory suzuki parts that are interchangeable to make this happen or does it require custom fabrication?

7.) Starter motor: Do baleno started motors work with the Sierra flywheel? Looking at pictures the starter motor looks the same as a vitara.

List of other things that I have sorted (or know what I have to do):
Sump: Combine the 1300 + 1600 sumps and join the oil pickups as required.
Dipstick: swap with 1300
Fan: use 1300 engine fan
Radiator: use 1300 radiator (it is in good nick)
Adaptor plate: using BenT's kit
Author:  lump_a_charcoal [ Tue Nov 17, 2009 8:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
That is a good price for the motor and gear, does he have many more?

I heard with the Balenos you need a different crank for them...
Author:  Zachius [ Tue Nov 17, 2009 8:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Not sure if the wrecker has anymore. The wrecker is in Sydney and the details are below.

Gary Rush Auto Wreckers
57-69 Tattersall Rd, Kings Park NSW 2148
(02) 9676 5499‎

I don't see why the Baleno motor would need a different crank :?:
Author:  BenT [ Tue Nov 17, 2009 9:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
1. Have a look and see if there are any removable flanges on the top of the tank. The Vitara in tank pump has a flange about 120mm diameter. The standard sierra fuel pickup is a pipe which is welded into the tank. Your long range one will probably be the same.

You could just run an external fuel pump. I use a VL Commodore pump mounted where the factory fuel filter goes. Lots of people make surge tank setups for external pumps, but I have never had a problem without one.

2. The Baleno manifold can mate up to the factory airbox using the factory rubber elbow joined to the baleno elbow.

3. Just fit the VSS to your speedo.

4. Correct.

5. Depends on the brand. Over here in NZ Coby extractors fit without mods.

6. Quite a bit of custom work required. Best solutions is to get a Jimny intake manifold, as in my experience the FWD setup is a pain to setup correctly and is prone to getting airlocks without the thermostat at the highest point at the front of the engine.

7. No, check the bolt pattern, It will be different.

Ben
Author:  PJ.zook [ Tue Nov 17, 2009 10:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
1.) I assume by fuel pickup on side of tank you mean the fuel filler neck? The pickup would be bolted in the top of the tank. You may have a LWB Vitara fuel tank. Find out if it does have an internal swimmer pump. If it doesnt, you can run an external electric pump. If you want us to tell you waht tank it is, post some pictures.

2.) You can use the standard Baleno filter housing and adapt it to fit into a sierra, but keep in mind it wont seal well even if you can get it connected to a snorkel. Another thing to note is the filter is tiny, which is fine for onroad, but in real dusty conditions it will clog up easily.
I used a steel airbox i found at a wreckers, dont know what its from, but it suited perfectly. Could mod it easy as it was all steel, and a standard commondore paper filter element fitted straight in.

3.) There is a good writeup on how to do this speedo conversion, will try and find it for ya.

4.) This is what most people do, unless you want to spend a few hundred on a converter box from the USA. Its reasonably easy to graft it into your sierra cluster.

5.) A lot of us use Wildcat extractors for the Vitara, you will have to trim a little off youre engine mount unless you want to mod the extractors.

6.) This pretty much requires a little fabrication, basically whatever you can do to make it fit. For example what I did was to make two flanges the same as the thermostat housing, then weld some RHS to the flanges to bring the thermostat housing around 180deg and position it over the exhaust manifold, then run a bit of pope and standard sierra hose. This was only meant to be temporary, but its working well so i left it.

7.) Cant really help you here, i cant remember which starter i used, i think it was maybe the original sierra starter. You will have to shave a little off the block to get it to fit.
Author:  royce [ Tue Nov 17, 2009 10:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Long range sierra tanks the sender goes in the side of the tank, there is no seperate pickup
Author:  Zachius [ Wed Nov 18, 2009 12:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
:oops: you are correct... the fuel pickup is just a pipe coming out of the tank, got confused thinking it came out of the bolt in fuel gauge sender. Picture of the tank is attached, I am pretty sure it is a custom tank made for sierra. It holds 70L :P (pity the current motor treats it like a 30L tank though :-/)

External fuel pump sounds the way to go.

Will have to go and talk to the my fabricator friend to see what he reckons about the thermostat housing. Jimny intake manifold sounds expensive :-/

Anyone know which model swifts and/or vitaras had the VSS in the speedo?

Things to add to my parts list:
High Pressure Fuel hose (to replace current hose)
VL Commodore Fuel Pump
EFI Fuel Filter
Vitara Narrow-Body starter motor
Swift/Vitara Speedo
Author:  zookernator [ Wed Nov 18, 2009 1:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
some of your answers might be in here matey :)
http://www.auszookers.com/index.php?nam ... pic&t=4853
Author:  BlueSuzy [ Wed Nov 18, 2009 1:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
This is my thread of my Baleno conversion.
http://forum.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtop ... lit=baleno
There is a ton of info from me and others.
PJ.zook and i were pretty much doing it together but in different states :lol:

I hope you got the coilpack version with the coilpacks on the cam cover.. Otherwise goodluck with the dizzy!

I hope the thread helps. (there is alot, alot of info)

With your tank i would steer towards a surge tank and carbie electric fuel pump to the tank, and the an efi fuel pump from the tank. Also explained in the thread.

Oh and that wreckers. Its Pick and Payless. My Mummy works there :wink:
My 1st baleno motor cooked itself, then my second motor is from there. $450 muhahaha





(pls dont ban me for refering to the "otherforum")
Author:  Zachius [ Thu Nov 19, 2009 12:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Thanks for all the advice. Turns out I can get Coby extractors to Auckland (my grandparents live there) for $250 NZ = $200 AU, which seems cheap.

Anyone got any idea how much postage would be for extractors from NZ to AUS?

@Bluesuzy: Yep got the coilpack version.
Author:  Zachius [ Wed Dec 09, 2009 4:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
So now the Sierra is off the road :-( The camshaft timing belt gear of the 1.3 decided it did not want to stay on...

So I really want to get moving on this to get the Sierra back on the road. I need some help with the fabrication work on the sump and oil pickup considering I don't have the tools (and skill probably). Is there anyone in Newcastle who can help me out? I would be willing to pay.

Is there any decent fabrication shops in Newcastle that would do this for a decent price, actually know what they are on about and do a decent job?
Author:  BlueSuzy [ Wed Dec 09, 2009 4:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
If i was closer i would probably help seeing i know what has to be done :oops:
Author:  Zachius [ Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Another question. I am guessing that I need to run a fuel pump regulator? Can I use the fuel pump regulator out of a Baleno (I have easy access to one :-) ) ? I would guess that the Baleno one is external?

Alternatively a 6cyl Commodore VL / VK regulator, would this work?

Any advice is much appreciated
Author:  Fatzook [ Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Do you mean fuel PRESSURE regulator? If so, there is already one on your fuel rail.

All you need is to setup the pumps correctly.

Read here: Fuel system diagram
Author:  Zachius [ Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Yep, I meant pressure regulator. Yeah I checked the fuel rail and it is on there.

Thanks for the info.
Author:  MrRocky [ Sat Jan 09, 2010 4:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
i just used a cheap carby lift pump to suck the fuel out then feed into a bigger efi pump.
Author:  Zachius [ Fri Jan 22, 2010 11:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Anyone know a good place for obtaining "narrow body" Vitara starter motors?
Author:  v.w.dave [ Sun Jan 24, 2010 4:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Just shave your 1.3 down.
Author:  slowsierra [ Sun Jan 24, 2010 10:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
i had the baleno engine (coil pack model) put in sierra but the tacho (sierra dash) was not hooked up. i have identified the wire that sends the signal but what do i have to do to get the sierra tacho to work. cheers greg
Author:  Fatzook [ Mon Jan 25, 2010 12:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
slowsierra wrote:
i had the baleno engine (coil pack model) put in sierra but the tacho (sierra dash) was not hooked up. i have identified the wire that sends the signal but what do i have to do to get the sierra tacho to work. cheers greg


I'm pretty sure it won't work. :cry:
Author:  MrRocky [ Mon Jan 25, 2010 12:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
i wired in an aftermarket tacho of the 1 wire from the coil, but my model motor is series one with 1 coil mounted near the dizzy
Author:  Fatzook [ Mon Jan 25, 2010 12:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
MrRocky wrote:
i wired in an aftermarket tacho of the 1 wire from the coil, but my model motor is series one with 1 coil mounted near the dizzy


Yes your model with the seperate coil, and the model with the internal coil in the distributor will run off an aftermarket tacho, but the coilpack baleno is a different kettle of fish.
Author:  slowsierra [ Mon Jan 25, 2010 1:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
i had my brothers monster tacho hooked up to it and it worked fine. just wanting to know if i could some how just mount the baleno tacho in there? tried it awhile ago but could find what wire had to go where.
cheers greg
Author:  Fatzook [ Mon Jan 25, 2010 2:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
slowsierra wrote:
i had my brothers monster tacho hooked up to it and it worked fine. just wanting to know if i could some how just mount the baleno tacho in there? tried it awhile ago but could find what wire had to go where.
cheers greg


Fair enough. Ive never tried the baleno tacho. Worth a shot. If anyone knows how to do it, it would be PJzook. Maybe shoot him a PM.
Author:  BlueSuzy [ Wed Jan 27, 2010 2:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
I have Baleno coil pack gauges in the 1.3 sierra cluster. speedo and tacho.

Speedo was just a simple swap faces over, i used the vit vss cable internals. Coil Baleno's are electronic speedo.

Tacho is smaller then the sierra's. I used some of the baleno cluster surround into my sierra cluster so it looks normal, and you don't see the backing lights. With a bit of cutting it sits fine in there. No moving around, and mine is all held in with 1 screw only, going almost 2 years now!

Tacho is just a signal. So it needs power to work.

Find some accesorys power from the cluster, find an earth from the cluster, and get the tacho wire from the ecu. I worked out the 3 wires running onto the bal tacho, trial and error. It works fine now.

Then i had to set the baleno face back on the guage i think with baleno arrows. Also the speedo arrow was a tad tricky because it is alittle spring loaded..Reved the motor till it bounced of the limiter. Viola! there is the start line of redline setting where the needle bounces! (Up to you if you want to do this) :lol:

This is a link of mine and pj's thread. http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/phpBB2/ft ... sc-150.php That page has same details as what i have just said. If you want to see it all, go to the start of the thread. There is alot of info on there.

Pics:
stocko 91 wt gauges/cluster
Image
Baleno gauges into wt dash type cluster
Image
Image
Author:  Zachius [ Sun Jan 02, 2011 6:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Grave Dig... :D

So, I have actually slowly been doing a few things here and will be taking a week off work in February to hopefully sort out the rest of it.

We ground down the 1.3 starter and it now fits :)

I have managed to pull the wiring loom out of the Sierra and have the Baleno wiring from the firewall forwards (I have another whole wiring loom in a completish Baleno that I have to pull out).

Does anyone have the complete Baleno wiring diagrams that show the pinout for the ECU. I need the complete wiring diagrams to work out the air conditioner wiring (yes I am attempting to keep my factory sierra a/c) The only ones I can find are for a different ECU :(
Author:  CairnsZook [ Sun Jan 02, 2011 6:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
What year Baleno engine do you have? I may have a complete wiring diagram for you.
Author:  Zachius [ Sun Jan 02, 2011 6:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
the engine is from a 2000 model with a single wire oxygen sensor. I am expecting Pin A11 to be VCC (Power source for sensors).
Author:  BlueSuzy [ Sun Jan 02, 2011 9:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Only use the sierra wiring system for the aircon system. There is only 1 load wire on the motor to aircon comp to tell the ecu aircon is on. Like Powersteer pump also. You should be able to trace it once the harness is on the motor.

All you need is motor running wiring.
Author:  Fatzook [ Sun Jan 02, 2011 10:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 1.6 EFI Baleno conversion
Zachius wrote:
the engine is from a 2000 model with a single wire oxygen sensor. I am expecting Pin A11 to be VCC (Power source for sensors).


My manual says A11= Eng start signal (B/Y). A12= Power source (R/B)
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