[luke3411]

Hey guys. My 95 swb vitara is stock at the moment but have a calmini 3' suspension lift arriving in a few weeks from the states. I'm a bit whimmed out at the last time I went for a wheel I nearly lost it at low speed's on corrugated road. Especially un-nerved when trying to gain control again going around a corner and a landcruiser towing a huge caravan came the other way around the corner. By sheer luck and not totally shitting myself and doing something stupid, I was able to avoid colliding with the other vehicle and caravan in tow. And it almost felt that at any moment it was going to just tip over.

Now I've been told that swb 4wd's are notoriose for having this problem. I dont mind slowing it down on the ruts but If I want to get any where it's going to be very long indeed. (at times i didn't get out of third gear!!) I used to own a holden Barina which I was able to take down similar tracks and was doing sometimes 90+kmh no problem. Didn't feel uncomfortable at all Mind you I'm a little older and maybe a little less stupid now

So is my new suspension system and some good at's or mt's going to overcome this problem a little bit? Can I widen the wheel base to better handle the roll factor and how? I've come to terms with having to cut up the guards and fit flares on my car. It's the first time I've owned a zook and all I've driven before is big old heavy dinosuars that dont move an inch.

Also is there anyone that can tell me of any good tracks around the Darwin area? Just moved here pretty much and I'm keen to explore. Cheers

[hooki]

hey mate, it may be possible that the old suspension on your vitara is a bit flogged out causing excessive body role. On the other hand you may just not be use to the higher centre of gravity and driving characteristics of a 4wd.

You may just need to slow down a little to a point that you are comfortable driving at. Recovering from oversteer in a swb zook on pea-gravel roads always feels dodgy, it's nothing out of the ordinary .

If the suspenion is original on your vitara then i'm sure the new kit will tighten the handling up heaps. 16 year old suspension will be very tired by now .

[banga]

i just installed mine the other day handles better than before but my ball joint on the top of my diff was very very loose. the kit has made the car a hole lot more predictable.
i find the rear quite soft compared to the front but i don't have a front bar on yet plus mine is a long wheel base and i believe the kit is really made for swb. And the road tires that i run around on are 215/75/15 on standard offset rims which also doesn't help the front out to much. calmini recommend wider offset rims and larger tires.

[Mistaria81]

calmini suspension doesn't have that good of a rep from what i've seen on here, sometimes the kits r good and no drama's and other times the not even worth the time and effort getting them. if your uber worried, take a trip down to pedders and ask them to take a quick look, might be something loose under neath or the shocks might bestuffed. until the kit arives, just take it easier than normal

[luke3411]

Cool, well hopefully the new suspension will overcome the car having a mind of it's own. Yeah at the moment it is stock and the tyres even though having heaps of tread are only made for road use I'm pretty sure. Hopefully once the kit is installed and the tyres are upgraded I should be able to get some control back on the zook on these rutty roads. When It was doing it's own thing the other day my girlfriend in the passenger seat was shitting herself and swearing like a sailor while I uttered a simple "shit" and concentrated on not over correcting and bringing it back into line. Actually quite happy with the way I controling it.

Wet season is only just around the corner and I'm tossing up to get mt's or at's. My car is a daily driver but I'm out on the tracks up to 4 times a week. Gotta love living in the top end and being only a half hour drive from the city into the bush. What are other zookers opinions of choice of tyres considering the use that my car gets. My days of purposly trying to get my car sideways on the highway are well and truly over I'll ad as well.

Also I've found a front bar that I've got a fair bit of interest in. It's an alloy bullbar with a bash plate. Theres no Mounts for a winch but I'm not really concerned about getting one as the cost is huge. I've got a 4 tonne hand winch that has served me well. Or should I go with the full steel winch bar and a winch To get the extra weight for the front? Probably should but first time I've owned a zook so want to be sure I'm spending my money wisely.

[SuziBlu]

What sort of tyre pressure are you running, too much and it will make your vehicle a pig on dirt roads.

22psi is fine, no more.

[alien]

you'll also probably find that the SWB and rear wheel drive makes for a car that spins out easier than the front wheel drive barina.

i can throw my sierra on 31s with SPOA around on the gravel very fast.. infact i've got a screenshot of my gps showing me doing 110km/hr on winding gravel roads... theres no way i'd do it if i didnt know my car though (i also had the gps so i knew what was ahead of me as far as cornering).

i'd suggest you go out and get some practice on those roads, once you learn how it behaves you should be fine.

[royce]

I can drive faster that is likely safe with no feeling of anything bad likely to happen in mine, having suspension that works and tyres designed for the surface they are on plays a big part

youll also get to learn how they handle differently but how long they will hold on for, vits are pretty wide so youd have to be really fnaging to even think of rolling

[steve]

Vitaras are dangerous and roll easy without warning, we've rolled two this year.

[atari4x4]

royce wrote:

I can drive faster that is likely safe with no feeling of anything bad likely to happen in mine, having suspension that works and tyres designed for the surface they are on plays a big part

youll also get to learn how they handle differently but how long they will hold on for, vits are pretty wide so youd have to be really fnaging to even think of rolling

x2 mine punts along at a fair rate of knots before getting unhappy & even then it's still predictable, it loves being steered with the throttle.

drive to you & your cars ability & it will most likely never be a problem.

[alien]

steve wrote:

Vitaras are dangerous and roll easy without warning, we've rolled two this year.

i thought you were going to follow that up with a "you should sell yours to me for your own safety" =) lol

my 110 stint was actually 115... but you can see on the data the average was more like 70km/hr:

[missmyljdaze]

OI Alien-

Quick heads up for you, that map of yours is in the vicinity of our rifle range, we will be doing a lot of work there this weekend.
We have been instructed by DEC and the Water Authority mob to re-do our fences and signage as they are getting a bit antsy about the amount of cars, 4wd's, trail bikes, mountain bikes, horses etc going illegally through the quarantined dieback zones and water catchment areas.

Our fences, gates and "live firing zone" signs are continually being either cut or stolen, and the DEC/Water Authority barriers are being bypassed for unauthorised access.

The polite version I got from a DEC bloke a while back was along the lines of they might be treating tresspassers the same as poachers to set an example (lose your equipment/ vehicle if caught)

Our rifle range runs from just under where "Pickering Brook" is indicated on your map, goes for several klicks in a roughly south easterly direction.
We are in for a lot of work as we have been granted permission to double the usable area inside our lease- involves about 1 acre of clearing, and lots of earthworks.

[alien]

yeah i know about the rifle range =) can hear the gunshots from the school (where we met up that day back in january)... we were only on the main roads though, went up to the top of mt dale then took ashendon rd back to mundaring weir rd.

i dont think i saw a single fence or sign for the shooting range while i was out there.. NFI who could be stuffed cutting fences and stealing signs anyway, seems pointless to me.

back on topic though - those roads are VERY fun to drive with their winding corners and trees right up against the roadside... the trees make it feel like you're going twice the speed =) hehe

[missmyljdaze]

If you stick to the open tracks you are ok,
We have had entire fences stolen- pickets- wire- strainers, signs @ 50 or so at a time, boom gates and farm type gates stolen or ripped out or bush trashed so they can bypass them.
I have inspected the fenceline before shooting starts- and by lunchtime it has been cut by trailbike riders.
We have had to stop shooting a few times when the crew in the target gallery pit lifting the targets have heard the bikes arriving to use the stop-butts mound for a ramp!
(Stop-butts is the big pile of dirt the bullets go into after passing through the targets)

I prefer moving targets- but would be awkward to dispose of afterwards!

[alien]

nutters - maybe you do need to thwack one in the fuel tank of their bike or something (their nuts would be a worthwhile consolation prize if you missed).

[luke3411]

Lol thats funny as. I've stumbled onto rifle ranges before and not known it until some very angry man catch's up with you lol.

So tyre choice guys? I'm considering doing a trip from Darwin to the Gove peninsula (Nhulunbuy). Used to live there and need to pick up my stuff.
Mostly dirt track with rut's and a couple of river crossings. Would All terrain tyres be the best option for a trip like this? Gonna get a snorkel as well. Been told the Goyder isn't to high this time of year but just in case. Gonna do this trip in a few months hopefully. Plenty of time just before wet season.

[alien]

the issue with AT's is theyre not good at anything... for that kinda job i reckon the maxxis bighorns will be hard to go past for price and quality.

[Gwagensteve]

Vitaras aren't at all likely to roll over, (unlike Sierras) however, they are far more likely to go off the road backwards.

Heavily burnt by the sierra rollover fiasco in the US, they built a car that's almost unrollable on road. Like a road car, you'd have to trip it to flip it.

However, whilst Suzuki were able to build a car that is very hard to roll, they some how managed to build a car that drives like a bucket of poo.

The problem is hugely mismatched roll centre front to rear. It makes the rear feel like its trying to roll over whilst the front remains flat and pointy.

I HATE the handling of stock Vitaras. I think it's dangerous.

It's going to feel far less comfortable and intuitive than your barina, mostly because the barina is a conventional front wheel drive car and that means it's an understeerer.

Vitaras's tend towards oversteer, especially on trailing throttle (when the rear goes light)

Will you Calmni kit help, well, sort of.

It's going to raise the car. That increases the likelyhood of a rollover. However, the lift comes with a strange side effect. The rear roll centre stays exactly where it is once lifted, but the front roll centre comes up. That's good because it makes the car feel much more settled whilst cornering - it feels like it's rolling around the same axis front and rear as opposed to feeling like the back is falling over the front.

Bear in mind though that there's plenty of good and bad about the Calmini kit. It requires wide/offset rims to add leverage to the front end and soften it up, otherwise the front will be very high and hard and will break the struts in short order because the struts will be topping out.

The kit is also intended for a bar and winch (and a fair load in the back)

For good fast road handling you might want to swap the calmini springs out for some ome springs to get better behaviour at speed.

(Theres nothing special about the Calmini springs, struts or shocks in terms of road handling - it's on "off road" kit)

Steve.

[luke3411]

I've noticed lots of them advertised on ebay. Some of them come on 'Terra' rims which look like sunny's to me.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/4X4-31X10-5R ... 3f0ba55ba5

Not to sure what the freight is but I can find out. Would these rims be worth buying and what sort of offset would I be after for my Vitara?

[luke3411]

ok so definately going to get a winch set up now. If it's made for it then I spose it be wise to get one in time. Weight in the rear is no problem as I have it full of fishing gear and I'll get a rear bar installed as well. It's turning into a very gradual build up. May take me six months or so to get everything up to scratch and hopefully the calmini shocks, springs and struts will hold out until I get the ome stuff on there. I'll try and leave that till last.

So how do I find out if a rim has a wide offset? I reckon someone could tell me it has and I'd believe them. I think I have an idea how it works.

[atari4x4]

offset tech http://auszookers.com/index.php?name=Fo ... set+speedy

[luke3411]

Wow that seems like alot of fucking around. Ok. what would be the ideal offset? What is the one that is recommended with the calmini set up?

[Gwagensteve]

[buzbox]

With 20psi in the tyres, 3"Calmini 2"body lift, I have had mine very sideways on one particular gravel road, I felt the tyres biting in but fully loaded with camping gear It still felt rather stable. The corner caught me by suprise and to prevent it from spinning right around I just planted it. After the tank slapper I had to pull over and change my undies. Although once I caught my breath, I turned around and did it again.

[stocker]

I today just wacked a set of dobinsons struts in the front of mine... whilst adding a bit of extra flex in the front end. they are a much softer, better ride. i've got a bar on the front of mine now (no winch...for now) and its a great ride, would definitely recommend the upgrade

[atari4x4]

luke3411 wrote:

Wow that seems like alot of fucking around. Ok. what would be the ideal offset? What is the one that is recommended with the calmini set up?

you wanted to learn about offset...

[joeblow]

Unlike what some other people have said Vitaras do drive nice. They are stable and well handling.



The problem is the people who drive them and set them up.

Yes, lets go around dirt corners with the tyres at 45 psi....that won't be dangerous...

Lets lift the buggery out of them and do nothing about gearing....that will help with full throttle hill climbs.

Or maybe the fact people drive them like sports cars....which they are not.

I have never had any issues with swb or lwb Vits offroad, and that goes for Sierras too.

[luke3411]

Cool. So I need a rim with a posative offset that will stick my wheel further out from the body. I like this. So how much offset will I need to achieve this? Sorry if I sound like a no brainer. Just keen to learn

[atari4x4]

luke3411 wrote:

Cool. So I need a rim with a posative offset that will stick my wheel further out from the body. I like this. So how much offset will I need to achieve this? Sorry if I sound like a no brainer. Just keen to learn

you want negative offset.


personally I run a 15x7 -15 with 31x10.5r15's on my vitara with the calmini suspension & a 2" bodylift

[luke3411]

And how is that working out for you? Thats pretty much exactly the same sort of combination lift I want as well to fit under my 31' tyres. How much cutting or hammering did you have to do to clear the body at lock?