[Trypt]

Im seriously considering converting my ac comp into an air compressor. im just wondering if the sierra compressors are suited to this.
and what the safe working pressure is on the compressor.
they are quite abit smaller then the endless/sanden compressors and look abit different in terms of inlet and outlet locations.
Will filling the housing with grease be sufficient or using an inline oiler on the inlet side be better.
once im confident the standard compressor will suffice i will start a thread.

[want33s]

Sierra rotary compressors have been converted to Endless-Air setups but they require an oiler on the intake to lubricate them and an oil trap/recirc on the outlet to stop oil going into your tyres/lockers/beach ball. Rotary compressors have high outlet air temperatures so you'll need good air fittings and when you air up from EG: 8 to 20 psi you should check your tyres 10 minutes later (without driving) and they'll all be different pressures due to the cooling air.
Sanden rotary AC compressors have been modified with porting and grease packing and get good results.
http://www.grungle.com/endlessair.html



A much better AC pump is a York piston compressor but they are a lot larger and heavier.
Their advantage is a built in sump so they can run 100% duty cycle with no external lubrication.
They are older technology and run a larger volume at lower pressures, not so good for modern AC systems but great for E-A.

York.

[Trypt]

Want33's is your real name god?
I have seen York compressors used but I don't want
To sacrifice anymore space in the engine bay
Plus there is a compressor sitting there not being used.
If it's been done before I'll do it again

Any ideas on where to mount a tank?

[want33s]

How big is the tank?
I've seen tanks mounted in engine bays, under floors on rear wheel arches, under seats.
I have even seen barwork that was the tank but I'm not sure I'd recommend that.

[Trypt]

Been thinking if i can get my hands on two or three small fire extinguishers i can hid them in the rear door. just need to be careful where the air line comes out.

[want33s]

If you use extinguishers be sure to mount them and the plumbing so that water can be drained out.
If you don't you'll end up with a tank full of water.


As far as safe pressures go... I would fit a pressure switch to the tank wired to the AC clutch via a dash mounted switch and light so once activated at the dash the compressor will run until it reaches cut out pressure and then stop. It will restart automatically once pressure drops to cut in point.
Pressure switch rating will depend on what you want from the system.

[Trypt]

im on a budget so ive ordered some stuff from fleabay.
ive already got 1/2'' air hose.
ive got an air source treatment system coming (adjustable inline oiler and oil/water filter)
some nitto fittings and now i just need a pressure switch. i would like to be able to run air tools and fill tyres obviously
90-120psi switch can be at my door for less than $15 i always 80-100psi was the norm but i cant find any on ebay.
is 120 asking too much from suzi rotary comp

[want33s]

I've seen them do 140psi but they get VERY HOT..

Never seen one catch fire but it is a possibility with the oiler infeed.

The lower the pressure you can get away with the better.

[Trypt]

ill have stop clenching my sphincter and get a proper car compressor switch.
do i need to worry about a check valve

[bazook]

ozook has done a setup with a sanden one
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=6124&start=240

[Trypt]

Thanks bazook.

[Trypt]

Got my hands on one fire extinguisher. once i get all my goodies in the mail i will make a detailed thread on conversion

[gregc]

put a $ figure on your budget Trypt.

You might find a better result from an electric pump for the same price.

I'm guessing an endless air is out of your budget from the sounds of it - but they are awesome - and are now available in a 10cfm unit - which would be even better again.

[Trypt]

im not keen on electric compressor just using up more space i can use for other things. if the denso compressor doesnt work out i will get a sanden and just fab up some mounts, while still using all my air lines outlets and tanks. i thought endless made 9 cfm and 12 cfm. i would be happy with 6-8cfm. taking into consideration the amount of volume in air lines and tanks that will be sifficient to run the air tools i have.

i could however go out and buy an endless but why spend that money when i can have some fun improvising and fabbin and put the ac compressor to use.
so far i have spent about 60 bux and i have what i need with the exception of a pressure switch. mind you i had to buy a new belt.

[gregc]

I have one of the 6cfm endless airs, but if I was buying one today I would get one that pushes even more air - you can never have too much right?

Sounds like you're enjoying the process more than anything else though.

Check out airide.com.au for your pressure switches.

[Trypt]

I get immense satisfaction out of making things work in a way they were not meant to and yes i agree no such thing as too much air.
do i need to go to an aircon techy to get the refridgerent taken out?

[want33s]

Trypt wrote:

I get immense satisfaction out of making things work in a way they were not meant to and yes i agree no such thing as too much air.
do i need to go to an aircon techy to get the refridgerent taken out?

Near the compressor you will see little plastic caps over the suction and pressure ports. These ports use a valve very similar to a tyre.
Flick the valve with a nail or similar and see if there is any pressure in the system.
If pressurised go to an AC place and have the system evacuated. Some places do this for free as they keep and resell the gas.
If no pressure in system just start undoing hoses.

[Trypt]

thanks very much will try that now

[Gwagensteve]

I don't want to rain on anyone's parade, but rotary vane compressors, as used in factory sierra/vitara systems, will not work as air compressors, even when used with an oiler, and you won't find anyone who has managed to make one work for any period of time.

An ex club member spent an enormous amount of time and effort trying to get a Denso ( I think) rotary vane compressor to work, including modifying the oil galleries inside the compressor, and using an oiler.

The end result, even after all the work, was a very short lived compressor, which delivered not very much, very hot compressed air.

I tried something similar at around the same time with an oiler and filter/dryer and it was a failure. So little air was compressed it was pointless unless heaps of oil was poured into the unit, where it compressed well, until it had finished pumping all the oil out.

From my experience, Get a york or Sanden if you want an engine driven compressor. I had a york on my Gwagen, (factory fit for that car) and it ran as air compressor for years with no attention. Endless air compressors are modified Sanden units, and also work well with little/no maintenance.

I was very keen to run a York/Endless setup on my car, but in all honesty, it's hard to argue with 6.5CFM/150PSI from the ARB twin motor compressor.

I don't really get the space thing. Both Sanden and York compressors are quite heavy/bulky, and will involve custom brackets, along with a tank. The whole setup will add more weight/bulk than the ARB compressor, which will go under a seat.

Steve.

[Trypt]

150psi is far to much for running air tools that are rated to 90-100. your point is valid and i will take it into account, though like i said before if the denso fails i can replace it with a sanden/york and still use all my air lines and tanks other than that its more fun to fab and build a system then to bolt a compressor in that arb is making rediculous profits off and the extra load on the already under powered alternator makes me nervous.

[Gwagensteve]

I never tried to run my rotary ane compressor above 100PSI. That's not why it failed, it's because rotary vane compressors aren't designed to pump air. They have very large "wiped" seal areas (kind of like a rotary engine) and unless they are kept WET, they fail. There's very surprising amount of oil in a AC system, and its there to lubricate the pump. Adding a few drips of oil now and again (as you would do with a tool oiler) isn't sufficient.

So it's not if the denso fails, it will fail. It will last just long enough that you think you have got it to work, then die.

Pull it out now and sell it as a working compressor, and get a sanden or York.

I don't think there is anything ridiculous about what ARB charges for its twin motor compressor, and I have set up engine driven on board air systems. Price up all the components, add in your time spent trouble shooting, and the ARB compressor looks very reasonable.

As for running air tools, sure, you can regulate down to whatever you like after the tank, but the reason to run 150PSI is to maximise storage in the tank.

Steve.

[Trypt]

Not trying to start an arguement here but i beg to differ on the ''rotary vane compressors are not ment to pump air"
The Vacuum pump at worth is rotary vane and whilst i admit it does not compress air it has the ability to. with no vacuun load it pumps close to 200l/sec and the restriction caused by the oil seperator means the output charge is very much compressed maybe not 100 psi but compressed nontheless. As for your statement about wet wipe seals i agree the oil feed on the pump is high flow so much so that the ernormous collector cannot keep up with it.

[got_bar_work]

I wasn't that impressed with my new arb compressor
I thought it would have been faster for the money
Once it is mounted in my ute with the tank it should be fine though
The bigest problem is the output temp
U can't run a normal air line off it
It just melts
I got a ss braided line made up to go from the compressor to water trap so hopefully that helps

[Gwagensteve]

Trypt wrote:

Not trying to start an arguement here but i beg to differ on the ''rotary vane compressors are not ment to pump air"
The Vacuum pump at worth is rotary vane and whilst i admit it does not compress air it has the ability to. with no vacuun load it pumps close to 200l/sec and the restriction caused by the oil seperator means the output charge is very much compressed maybe not 100 psi but compressed nontheless. As for your statement about wet wipe seals i agree the oil feed on the pump is high flow so much so that the ernormous collector cannot keep up with it.

I think this only reinforces my point(s), so no argument here from me.

I'm also going to assume the vacuum pump you speak of was designed to vacuum air.

Steve.

[Trypt]

To create a vacuum air must be removed.... pumped

[Trypt]

got_bar_work wrote:

I wasn't that impressed with my new arb compressor
I thought it would have been faster for the money
Once it is mounted in my ute with the tank it should be fine though
The bigest problem is the output temp
U can't run a normal air line off it
It just melts
I got a ss braided line made up to go from the compressor to water trap so hopefully that helps

I dont think you can get around the heat generated from compressing air.
may i ask how much your compressor was and what the flow rate is

[got_bar_work]

I think it was 500-600 I got it as part of my new car
I just got the dealer to buy everything I wanted on my ute and add it to the price
That way my company pays for my touring rig
As for output u would have to check arb site
I know it takes a few min to get a tire back up to 50psi

[Trypt]

Ok thank you