[Trypt]

Before you shoot me down, ive already done a search

I want to install a snorkel and as everyone very well knows sierra airbox's leak like a sieve.
im going to be making an intercooler piping style snorkel.
Just wondering my options are for an airbox upgrade Im also seen some airbox's that take a generic pod.
can u get paper element pods or are they all K&N style oil gauze?

Cheers in advance

[atari4x4]

hiace van cyclonic barrel filter?


viewtopic.php?f=4&t=14025&p=406600&hilit=air+box#p406600

[Trypt]

so do i just put a couple of 6v torch batteries to crank off?

[atari4x4]

easy fixed, mount ya battery under the passenger seat for better weight distribution.

bladdy sierra's... i didn't even notice the missing battery, i knew they were bare bones motoring but not that bare.

[Trypt]

Is there something that requires less modification, such as not moving battery haha. that hiace setup looks like abit of overkil for a 1.3 shitbox

[atari4x4]

d22 navara looks pretty small?

bazook wrote:

i use the air box out of a d22 nissan
this picture is my old car but my lwb has the same box

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=21532&p=374508&hilit=baleno+air+box#p374508

[want33s]

Just go to your local wreckers and look at as many cars as you can...
You'll find something suitable..

Most jap 4wds (Except Suzuki) have metal air filter housings.

GQ 4.2 pre filter might suit you.

[Trypt]

that d22 box does look pretty good.
thanks want33s ill go and have a pick some time this week

[KEENSY85]

atari4x4 wrote:

d22 navara looks pretty small?

bazook wrote:

i use the air box out of a d22 nissan
this picture is my old car but my lwb has the same box

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=21532&p=374508&hilit=baleno+air+box#p374508

that nice so my style i love that engine bay

[matty_wall]

Jimny boxes are small and the inlet and outlet are in the correct position.

[BlueSuzy]

2.0Lv6 vit airbox. Box intake is on bottom, directly opposite the engine intake pipe

Nice shape to go through guard and a hose will fit on

[Trypt]

BlueSuzy wrote:

2.0Lv6 vit airbox. Box intake is on bottom, directly opposite the engine intake pipe

Nice shape to go through guard and a hose will fit on

I like this alot! and its panel filter right?

[BlueSuzy]

Yep, Filter is dear though. Not sure what other options prices are.

$34? from memory



Sits above guard line but fits under bonnet nice

[Trypt]

Looks like a pretty big filter, i doubt i would need to change it very often so the $34 doesnt sound so bad...

[KEENSY85]

34 is pretty cheap still iv been looking @ k&n air boxs on ebay

[BlueSuzy]

34 is filter only.

[Trypt]

the pointlessness of k&n filters on a 4wd have been discussed on here.
If you know whats good for ur engine you wont get one

[KEENSY85]

Like this 1

[Trypt]

yeah i would use something like that if u could paper element pod filters but i had a look and i dont think you can. there all gauze

[Gwagensteve]

KEENSY85 wrote:

Like this 1

They only work properly when chromed.

Seriously, k&n are terrible filters for a 4wd that sees any off road use. They filter poorly. Putting one in a box so you can attach a snorkel to it doesn't make it better, if just mean the too-small and poorly designed filter now cops every bit of junk that comes down the snorkel.

Hiace filters an be made to fit with a battery.

I don't like panel filters for 4wd use. Centrifugal filters work much better, which is why you'll never find a panel filter in an application designed for a dusty environment.

Steve.

[KEENSY85]

Can u get the Hiace air box's in Crome thou Steve ?????

[Trypt]

I spoke to a friend that bought my old car off me. he has since blown it up and said i can take whatever i want out of it.
airbox should be a nice fit.
Alternator should fit without modification and was quite new when i had the car + its v belt
hopefully the seats fit coz they were bloody good.

Gwagensteve wrote:

KEENSY85 wrote:

Like this 1

I don't like panel filters for 4wd use. Centrifugal filters work much better, which is why you'll never find a panel filter in an application designed for a dusty environment.

Steve.

Whats wrong with panel filters? the few barrel type filters i have seen get a "dirty spot" where the inlet is, particularly the sierra one

[Gwagensteve]

That's because Suzuki forgot how to design air boxes shortly before they forgot how to design suspension. Centrifugal filters should have a diffuser inside them that prevents the dirty spot and encourages the air to spin. This is critical as it causes the larger dust particles to be flung against the wall of the filter housing where they eventually reach the end and are trapped in a dust trap. Very little of the dust that enters the housing reaches the filter.

This is how the hi-ace and most hilux filters work. They are a copy of the Donaldson cyclo-pac filter, pretty much the standard for high-demand filtration.

Land cruiser filters don't have the diffuser, but they are designed to sit flat and have a much better dust trap arrangement.

Panel filters have a small surface area compared to a centrifugal filter. They rely on gravity to prevent heavy dust sitting in the fillter, not centrifugal force. In short, they are built down to a price based on a lower perceived demand for filtration, which is why they are more common on road cars.

Steve.

[Trypt]

Thank you for increasing my knowledge Steve, are the hilux filters small enough to fit with battery?

[Gwagensteve]

Hilux are too large in diameter. Hi-ace might fit with a battery in the normal spot, or swap the filter to the passenger side.

I think good filtration is worth the effort achieve, even though I currently have a stock g16b panel filter in piggles, it won't be there forever. I ran out of time to refit the hiace filter prior to the tour.

Steve.

[sando]

Steve new mil spec Gwagon's have panel filters, surely these are designed for dusty conditions? I was reading on another forum about how panel filters can work well as long you slow the air flow down to about 3m/sec so surely it can work well as long as you can slow the air down enough. In saying all this I do run a rodeo centrifugal filter after my donaldson prefilter...

[KEENSY85]

liking this thread

[Gwagensteve]

sando wrote:

Steve new mil spec Gwagon's have panel filters, surely these are designed for dusty conditions? I was reading on another forum about how panel filters can work well as long you slow the air flow down to about 3m/sec so surely it can work well as long as you can slow the air down enough. In saying all this I do run a rodeo centrifugal filter after my donaldson prefilter...

I'm sure it's possible to make a panel filter work, but there aren't many examples of panel filters being used in a vehicle application where high dust levels (and sensible service intervals*) are planned.

*And that's a big issue. Many people cite the use a panel/foam/gauze/pod filters in various racing applications as proof they bring the awesome and must be the best thing ever. Service intervals on filters in race applications are measured in minutes to hours, and engine rebuild intervals might be measured in tens of hours, not thousands of hours. The engine will generally break from stress before the dust it's eating has the chance to wear it out. That's the nature of the race environment.

Also, few race applications see really heavy dust, and guess what you find when you are looking at race cars that do see heavy dust:

One, or two, of these





see the massive filter housing under the spare tyre?



How about two?

Which are an alloy (and therefore light weight) copy of an donaldson cyclopac:



and contain a paper filter and centrifuge insert.



Anyways, back to the Gwagen thing.

My 1985 Gwagen has a centrifugal filter (it even has a tell-tale for when to service it) but the Gwagen engine bay is pretty crowded, and was never intended to fit a V motor. With the current V6 diesel in there, my guess is space for an adequately large centrifugal filter couldn't be found.

These photos seem to confirm it.

Here's a G350 CDI engine bay



and here's a 300GD engine bay



Not a great photo, but you can see how much breadth the V6 diesel is taking up, and also consider the filter would have to flow twice the air the 300GD filter was designed for.

Also consider that AFAIK, the australian Gwagens have to be road legal (unlike, say, the US army and their Hummers) so the emissions/ADR approval process would become quite costly if a new air filter arrangement had to be engineered. It's far easier to spec a shortened filter replacement interval then it is to try and engineer a better filter into a tight engine bay that isn't required.

Take as another example of the same thinking the wheel and tyre choice - alloys and BFG all terrains are hardly the best choice, but they are relatively cheap, ADR legal, and appropriate for what is a general purpose vehicle, not a front line vehicle.

The Canadian army specced their Gwagens as front line vehicles, and as such they are able to be fitted with armour, and run a MUCH more serious wheel any tyre setup



They're Hutchinson double beadlocks (run-flat) with 8.25X16 Michelins (34" tall)

Note that they also run snorkels, not even fitted to the Australian vehicles at manufacture.

So like everything, I'm going to suggest that the spec of the Australian Army Gwagens is a compromise based on cost, use, and subsequent legal resale. It's not the ultimate.

as an aside, note that the army's frontline wheeled vehicle, the Bushmaster, runs a.... wait for it..... donaldson Cyclopac. It's behind the panel with the chain hook hanging off it in this photo. (I've worked on Bushmasters on the production line, which is why I know)




Steve.

[sando]

Steve I am not doubting that centrifugal filters are great for dusty enviroments however I still believe that for a sierra a panel filter is suitable. Maybe not the best for long term engine life but is still fine. Also you are a little off with the gwagon specs but a public forum isn't the place to discuss it....

[Gwagensteve]

The Australian army Gwagens are a V6 though, are they not? I am aware it's not the G350CDI engine. It's the restriction of the V configuration that's the problem as I see it with the very narrow Gwagen engine bay rather than the specifics of the model.

Is a panel filter suitable? Sure, apparently Suzuki thought the turd that's in there stock was suitable too, i (and it's a better design and has a larger surface area than a panel filter, it's just badly executed) it's just that if you were going to remove the stock filter and change to something else, a panel filter would be the least preferred option (other than a pod), as much as anything because a large panel filter that's "off road" suitable (large and well sealed) will be just as much $$ and hassle to fit as a centrifugal filter.

Steve.