[camskea]

Hi all.... in the market for my first 4x4 suzi .....

All the ones i was interested in from the for sale section on this site are sold...

Spoke to the guy about this car yesterday, just after peoples opinions on it....

He said it needs the legal wheels for rwc and the large shackless taken out ...

All help would be appreciated, thanks. Link below

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/110964641617 ... 1423.l2649

[Gwagensteve]

I think the price is fair.. however, it's all going to hinge on the RWC.

I can't see the body lift, That may/may not be a problem.
It has shock hoops in the front - these will have been welded to the chassis. Again, may or may not cause problems for RWC.
The Weber? Same deal. Looks like it has extractors and exhaust. I wonder if it has a cat?
Obviously the shackles will have to come out and be thrown as far away as possible.

It doesn't look like it has done much off road work, which is a plus.

The modifications look to have been fairly neatly done.

Obviously it doesn't have lockers or gears. That's a plus in that it can't have done much off road with out them, it's a negative because depending on how long the owner has been driving it on the 31's with (apparently) stock gearing, it's going to have copped a flogging - especially the clutch.

It has a factory hard top. These are excellent and worth really good money.

It looks to be a good starting point, but It's probably not worth much more than what's on it now. Most of the money in the build is for shiny things (i.e no real performance improvement) Lights, rear bar etc.

Just my 2C. You could do worse - at least it doesn't look like any of the mods aren't reversible/require engineering.

Steve.

[camskea]

Thanks mate....I guess i'll keep it as an option, just see what happens with the price

[alexxx]

would be an awesome rig to own. but you could be opening up a monster can of worms once you start taking a closer look!!

[Gwagensteve]

I reckon "awesome rig" is a bit strong. It's tidy and all but doesn't still needs lockers, cromo's and gears to be useful in vic, which means it's really some lights, a winch of unknown quality and a 2" BL ahead of a stocker. IMHO the big dollars still have to be spent.

Steve.

[camskea]

Yeah Alexxx....thats kinda what Im worried about...
I got offered this the other day...its out of my budget but it seems like it would be a good first suzi 4x4..

Might just need some reduction gears I have been told...
Any thoughts??

its a 96 swb vitara (metalic grey)
1.6 carby motor
5 speed manual
pod filter (will come with standard airbox)
extractors
sports exhaust
winch bar
rock sliders
up graded locking hubs
led interior light
bucket seats
roof rack
dual battery system (with incab batt monitor)
will come with 235 75 15 bfg A/T's
pretty much new 15x7 black with red and white pin stripe sunnies x5
sunroof
2 inch ome supspension
2 inch body lift
piranha alternator cant remember amps
has got about 10-11 months rego come with roady
under 180,000 k's

[ninjamoses]

Sure you don't mean sierra? A 96 Vitara should not be a carby motor. If it is a Vitara pass on it if it has a carby motor installed.

[atari4x4]

that ebay sierra has the genuine suzuki hard top which can be sought after, but no mention of the massive shackles or the spare wheel carrier that hinges the wrong way.

[camskea]

Ninja moses....
I just copied what he PMed me... the pics he sent are of a Vitara...
I'll ask about it....

[camskea]

Apart from that...would the Vit be a decent offroader with the mods listed ?

[blakej]

or the fact his tyres are facing the wrong way. Did he make the huge shackles to compensate for his almost concave springs

[camskea]

Its just near my work so i might go have a look at it tomorrow.... that is if people dont think its a total heap of ...unable to be roadworthied...?

Is there anyhting I could take pics of to upoad, for people to be able to give any more opinions or ideas?
Thanks for the responses so far..
Cam

[Gwagensteve]

96 should definitely be EFI. IIRC 94 was the changeover year for EFI on vitaras.

X2 you don't want a carby vitara.

Camskea, you really need to work out what you want the car to achieve. There's no point buying a sierra with lift, 31's and heaps of work done to it if you are looking for a daily and mild off road work.

If you're looking for a car primarily for medium to harder 4WDing there's no point looking at a manual carby vitara with 30's on it (in my opinion, for victorian conditions) - you'll just be working against the car too much,

Off road capability starts (and almost ends) with lockers and gears. There's no reason to pay over the odds for a car that has lots of other stuff bolted to it if it has neither lockers or gears. Also consider that the more stuff that's been stuck to a car, the more scope there is for the previous owners to have hacked/dodgied up/butchered stuff. I was looking at a sierra the other day that had the winch bar welded on.... with the cheap and nasty winch inside it. to get the winch out the owner would have had to have cut the bar off the front of the car. That's not a feature, that's a liability.

Just an example.

Steve.

[ninjamoses]

camskea wrote:

Apart from that...would the Vit be a decent offroader with the mods listed ?

Probably depends on what he wants for it and what you plan on doing with it.

Those mods listed are fairly standard run of the mill stuff for Vits. The only not so common items there are the winch bar & rock sliders (and the sunroof - but depending on who did it and the condition of it that could be a negative).

It will go fine as it is, but offroad performance would be massively increased by a locker or two. That said, still wouldn't touch it if its a non-standard carby motor. I can't imagine anyone would do that though so maybe its a mistake/typo.

Your big ticket items (in terms of $$$ to do) in Vit modifications are:
- Bar work
- Lockers
- Steel front diff
- Diff gears (only for autos or SV models - gearing change for manual vits are pretty much non-existant)
- Transfer gears

Whether you want and/or need any of the above will come down to what you want to do with it. If you are only going sand/dune driving for example you don't really need any of it, as a matter of fact some of them will probably make you worse off.

[camskea]

Thanks again guys....
I should have been more clear about what I want i guess....

I have a VE daily driver, the Suzi will be for recreation around victoria off road. Just weekends getting away and hopefully to joing in some of the organised trips interstate..

I wanna thrash about in some mud and up some trails, will only be on public roads to get to the fun stuff.....

Cheers..

[DarkHorse]

Sounds like a Sierra would be the go, depending on how much people/gear you want to carry on weekends away.

Budget?

I'd be looking for a cheap stocker and then spend money on gears/lockers/tyres/suspension, or pay more for one with all the fruit done properly.

I'm not 100% on the Vic mod laws, but watch out for things like body lifts and replacement seats, as they often need engineering approval to be legal and registered. This could cost you an extra $500 or so straight up.

[camskea]

It would just be me and the two staffys in the car....maybe the GF or a mate... as for gear, just the basics and my spearfishing stuff...

Budget is about 5K....might be able to stretcha little for something really worth it...

Looking through the old posts i thought this budget was realistic....?
cheers

[camskea]

This one caught my eye too.... but its a coily which Ive read bad things about.... its a little out of reach price wise and the owner hasnt replied to my text to see if its even still for sale...

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=35276

[DarkHorse]

$5k should get you a good one.
Please don't start another Coillies are shit argument

How much mod work are you able to do yourself - fitting suspension, gears, lockers?

A cheap stocker has just popped up in Qld: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=36331
Transfer cases with gears come up fairly regularly here, better than $800 plus fitting for new sets.
Suspension can be cobbled together depending on how far you wanted to go, or EFS kits are fairly cheap.
Auto lockers are fairly cheap, $150ish each.
A second-hand set of 30"ish muddies will cost you a couple of hundred.

If you have to pay for labour it's that cost that will kill you.

After that stuff like barwork and accessories depends on taste really.

[3cyl]

Gwagensteve wrote:

I reckon "awesome rig" is a bit strong. It's tidy and all but doesn't still needs lockers, cromo's and gears to be useful in vic, which means it's really some lights, a winch of unknown quality and a 2" BL ahead of a stocker. IMHO the big dollars still have to be spent.

Steve.

I'm with Steve on this, mostly "look sik" accessories. As soon as I saw the shackles the alarm bells rang, even though you can take them off (and that's the first thing I'd do, even before I drove it home). They say so much about the vehicle and much worse the owner.

[camskea]

Im a bit of a tinkerer, so i like to work on my cars when its easy-ish stuff..like just unbolt one part and replcae it with the other...I usually look for internet tutorials with pics...

The stocker looks like a good deal but I think Im better off buying on with most of the stuff done as Im keen to get out in it.

Ok, so the red 'look sik' Sierra idea is in the bin....I know when to take advice from those more experienced.Thanks

I guess the search will continue........

[Plum]

I know of that SWB Vitara. It has been converted back to carburetor! I wouldn't touch it. Go Efi.

[camskea]

Thanks for that mate.... Unless he was willing to drop 3.5 grand I wasn't going to be able to afford it anyhow, lol...

[3cyl]

camskea wrote:

Ok, so the red 'look sik' Sierra idea is in the bin....I know when to take advice from those more experienced.Thanks

I guess the search will continue........

Don't get me wrong, still has some good points and if he drops the price a bit it may be an okay starting point but if he's had it offroad a bit ( which I doubt) you'd be putting in a clutch. Also you could sell those spotties to a Patrol driver.

[31zook]

Looks like you after a comfortable, easy to use, not super hardcore zook.

Vit/Jimny would be what I would point you in the direction of. Easy to work on, pretty decent ride (compared to a Sierra) a parts at every auto shop.

I think for the reliability, discomfort and space in a Sierra you might come away disappointed.

[DarkHorse]

You reckon for a weekend plaything he'd be better with a Jim or Vit than a Sierra? For a recreational/camping rig that's not daily driven I'd have thought mildly modded Sierra would be the go...

A couple with lots of fruit:

Lockers but an engineering nightmare - http://www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtop ... =7&t=34988
Unlocked but otherwise capable - http://www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtop ... =7&t=34913
This one you've seen - http://www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtop ... =7&t=36193
...and this one, I'd be confident with the recommendations from these guys, and it looks good - http://www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtop ... =7&t=34703
or a project - http://www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtop ... =7&t=36453

Then:
Calmini kitted case: http://www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtop ... =7&t=36457
Useful stuff - http://www.auszookers.com/forum/viewtop ... =7&t=36526

I guess you need to figure out exactly what you want.

[camskea]

The engineered one in Horsham has sold ...so has the nice black one in Queensland
An engineering ninghtmare is what Im trying to avoid ...lol
The white tin top could be a go....
I like the last one, converted into a ute....I can put the dogs on the back in summer...but it looks to be another engineering problem with the engine and diffs.....

Found a nice black one with lots of goodies in NSW.... but only engineered for NSW.. so the SPOA conversion would make it near impossible to register in Vctoria as Ive heard they dont pass SPOA anymore......

Theres always a catch

[Gwagensteve]

camskea wrote:

The stocker looks like a good deal but I think Im better off buying on with most of the stuff done as Im keen to get out in it.

And that is where it's going to get complicated.

A clean, RWC car with anything useful done ( and/or engineering approval, for say a 1.6 EFI) is likely to be beyond your budget... and you have be to be really aware that the stuff that's on it is stuff you'd spend your own money on, or there's no added value there.

I'll give you some more information on the car with the welded in winch as an example.

I think the new buyer paid $5K for it.

It was packing everything that opened and shut. Nice seats, winch, barwork, custom shock mounts, sports exhaust, air lockers, 31" silverstones, roll bar, "gears" (I'll get to that) winch, body lift, OME suspension, traction bar... it was in really nice nick too - clean, didn't look abused etc. it even had a rear storage unit/draws etc. It sounded totally excellent, and the owner rang me to pump up his own tyres about what a killer deal he got.

It was a total nightmare.

The body lift had been installed by cutting the studs off and welding some box to them. Not only was it illegal (as far as I can tell) it was also impossible to remove without major fabrication work. The rear axlehousing was bent and cracked. The wheelbearings were all shot. (badly shot) I've already mentioned the winch being welded in, on top of that, someone had spaced all the spring mounts down 2" for more lift. Again, no engineers, and no real chance of reversing it without lots of fabrication, or finding a new chassis.

To top it all off, the "gears" were 5.12 vitara diff gears, so it was spinning at over 4K on the highway but still had a rubbish low range.

The car was a basket case and the new owner sold it on quickly. It wasn't worth anywhere near 5K because of the amount of work required to put it legally on the road.

When it comes to buying an already modified car, it's buyer beware to the power of eleventy. It's so hard to get a reasonable price for a modified car that many people part a car out rather than try and sell complete.

I'm still not 100% sure what you're looking for though. I don't know if you have any off road experience, but you look to be targeting pretty heavily modified cars as a starting point. Have you been out for a trip with modified Sierras? Using that capability requires some pretty advanced off road skills, and if you have a set up car you'd be surprised how quickly you can get into trouble. Starting with a mild car and setting it up a your experience grows is really the best way of being happy with the outcome.

Might be worth coming to a Vic club meeting and seeing if you can come on a trip as a passenger. You'd get a much better idea of what you're looking for and what the type of cars you're looking at are able to drive.

Steve.

[camskea]

Great info...thanks....

O.k. so Im going to take the advice from the more experienced and just start looking for somethig well maintained and some basic stuff done to get me out on the tracks.

I dont want to restart the whole "coily"debate, but is someone new to 4x4 like me going to notice or be disadvantaged by the apparent short comings of the front end on the infamous coil model...

Basically, should I consider one or disregard them?

Thanks very much again to everyone for your help so far, much appreciated.
Cam

[Gwagensteve]

Disregard the coiler. Every time you want to buy a part or modify it it will fight you.

Not worth it for a nice front grille and dash.

Steve