[Gwagensteve]

If it has 99psi compression now it had 99 psi compression when it was parked, so that's not the problem.

Steve.

[tonyevans]

You don't think less than half the compression would make starting a little difficult?????????

[Gwagensteve]

Did it make starting difficult before the battery went flat?

Best check the tyre pressure too- it's going to be as relevant as compression. sorry, I'm not being a shit, but you're wasting your time checking the mechanical condition of the motor. It won't have changed since the battery went flat.

I might have missed this - have you swapped in a known good battery? I know you have charged the battery numerous times and it will crank the car, but I had a battery die in my STi and it would crank and start and run the car no problem. It didn't start once and needed a jump, and then about three weeks later, whilst driving down the road, the car just stopped - dead battery. It charged and jumped as per normal, but wouldn't run the car.

If the battery went as flat as it sounds, it's unlikely to recover properly, even though it might crank the car over.

Steve.

[tonyevans]

How about a brand new NZ70 - Oh no good it won't connect to the TINY battery clamps will it or fit in the tiny hole - I guess I will just pop down the shop and buy a new one - Oh the shop is 75ks away so I had better use the wheel barrow

I do see what you are saying Steve but things are not that easy out here - I am going to try and track down another battery tomorrow from a mate but I have tested this one with a battery load tester but right now I will try anything.

[atari4x4]

tried jump starting it with another car attached to the battery

[tonyevans]

Tried that with the NZ70 Battery but I only have shitty jumpers I use for charging from the Solar system

[JrZook]

Why not try paralleling the NZ70 battery with the jumpers to the battery that's already in there? Will give that extra bit of kick if needed.

[tonyevans]

JrZook wrote:

Why not try paralleling the NZ70 battery with the jumpers to the battery that's already in there? Will give that extra bit of kick if needed.

See Above

[stockman]

stockman wrote:

I had a similar issue recently.
Different vehicle, but similar issue.

-My ride on mower. Battery was flat, charged it and it held 12v. Cranked, but no start.
-Charged it again and boosted it off my car. Cranked, but no start.
-Replaced battery. Cranked and started first go.

I asked my electrician friend why it didn't start when I boosted it with another battery. His reply was the battery was farked and was sucking the power from the booster battery, but not letting it pass through.

Take out vit battery, put in good battery, hold terminals against battery poles and get your wife to crank?

[Red89]

Pull old battery out and run jumper leads from new battery to the battery leads running to the motor. When I cut my car up we had the fuel tank and battery sitting on the bonnet and just connected the cables and hoses to where they should be. Decent leads would be better though.

[tonyevans]

stockman wrote:

stockman wrote:

I had a similar issue recently.
Different vehicle, but similar issue.

-My ride on mower. Battery was flat, charged it and it held 12v. Cranked, but no start.
-Charged it again and boosted it off my car. Cranked, but no start.
-Replaced battery. Cranked and started first go.

I asked my electrician friend why it didn't start when I boosted it with another battery. His reply was the battery was farked and was sucking the power from the booster battery, but not letting it pass through.

Take out vit battery, put in good battery, hold terminals against battery poles and get your wife to crank?

See Above a couple more - You cant get an NS70 in the battery bay because it is too big.

I am going to cook tea now as I am starting to get pissed off and it's NOT at you guys because I know you are trying to help me - it's the bloody Vitara -

Tomorrow I will be calm
Tomorrow I will be calm
Tomorrow I will be calm
Tomorrow I will be calm












Maybe not

[GeckoXL7]

Wow hold terminals to bat lol and start the car... Goodbye tony... Have u sen a spanner fall on a car bat before?

Do as red89 says as sometimes if trying to jump a dead bat that's gone faulty the dead bat will drain the power from good bat.

[stockman]

GeckoXL7 wrote:

Wow hold terminals to bat lol and start the car... Goodbye tony... Have u sen a spanner fall on a car bat before?

I know Tony is not stupid.

I said hold terminals against battery poles not hold the poles.

[GeckoXL7]

I know lol. But there is people out there that are dumb enough thinking its only 12volt. Like putting a snatches strap on a tow ball.

I usually stay away from bat when jumping. Would clamp them

Think tony needs a mirical wake up and it just starts

[royce]

got me stuffed, check how many volts you have at the coil positive while the engine is cranking?

[tonyevans]

Taking a day off from it today and going to talk to an old mate of mine Ned Kelly No I have not lost it - He is a local property owner who used to run a bush wrecking yard here and is a bush mechanic of Looong standing.

If he can't work it out I might just ask Shep for instructions

PS - He might even have a new battery that will fit

[Mickc]

Hi Tony, look like you know more about this Vit then the rest of us but just
somthing the clever people on this forum might have overlooked.

The car starts and run for a second before cutting out and wet plugs indicate it could flooded.
In good old days cars used to have a start elect circuit and a run circuit, now its all in the ECU or is it?
Somebody might be able to verify if this true and how you might be able to test it.

PS. don't you wish it had a carby and points system?

[JrZook]

It could be possible that it is flooding/flooded. If so you could try removing the fuel pump fuse or relay and try cranking it over with a bit of throttle to see what happens

[TZAR]

I think I have a FSM for one of them. I'll see if I do and I could post it to you to help you out.

[tonyevans]

TZAR wrote:

I think I have a FSM for one of them. I'll see if I do and I could post it to you to help you out.

Well - I did not even know the Vitara had one of them -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Spaghetti_Monster

What the hell is a FSM Tzar?

[tonyevans]

Mickc wrote:

Hi Tony, look like you know more about this Vit then the rest of us but just
somthing the clever people on this forum might have overlooked.

The car starts and run for a second before cutting out and wet plugs indicate it could flooded.
In good old days cars used to have a start elect circuit and a run circuit, now its all in the ECU or is it?
Somebody might be able to verify if this true and how you might be able to test it.

PS. don't you wish it had a carby and points system?

Hi Mick - Rest assured "I know nothing" about these new fangled things or at least did not until it would not start - Since then I have been on a crash course - Tony

[tonyevans]

Just got hold of a BRAND NEW battery TWICE the size of the normal one in it - Jury rigged the leads - Result

Motor turned over like there was no tomorrow but did not start or fire at all.

[christover1]

FSM = Factory Service Manual.
The Haynes versions are less than helpful, I'm told.

Mine has an earth wire from back of head near dizzy, to the firewall.
It could be there for the dizzy?
Worth checking that.

[christover1]

Something is stealing the power from the spark.
May be a fault that also caused battery to drain on accessories.

[Zook_Fan]

What aftermarket electrical things are added to the car? Stereo? UHF? Have you checked all the fuses in the back of units like this? The fuses may have went when they were trying to draw power but the voltage from the battery was not sufficient and depending how they are wired could be disrupting a circuit?

[tonyevans]

christover1 - The manual I have is the Suzuki one on disk (PDF) but it is USA I don't know if there are different ones - I don't think so.
The manual Trouble shooting only talks about NO spark not Weak spark and I really do think this is the problem.
Just checked for that wire and it seem fine


ZookFan - It had a alarm system that I thought was the problem and have removed it entirely from the car - There is a stereo that replaces the original and that would be on standby with the key on Acc as well as the clock etc.

[JrZook]

Well to check that weak spark see if you can just clobber something together to test how far it can jump without shocking yourself. The breakdown voltage for an air gap of 1cm between 2 electrodes is roughly 30kV. Stock stuff should be able to jump that. Also check the voltage at the coil. Should be very close to the battery voltage.

[tonyevans]

JrZook wrote:

Well to check that weak spark see if you can just clobber something together to test how far it can jump without shocking yourself. The breakdown voltage for an air gap of 1cm between 2 electrodes is roughly 30kV. Stock stuff should be able to jump that. Also check the voltage at the coil. Should be very close to the battery voltage.

No way in the wide world would this spark jump 10mm - it can barely crawl across the spark-plug gap of 25tho. I really don't think it can spark at all under cylinder pressure.

I have to go to the dentist in Dubbo tomorrow to pick up my new teeth (in my trusty old FORD Econovan) 350ks each way and will be staying down there over night so will pick up a set of plugs and a distributor cap while I am there maybe even a rotor button then the whole lot will be new.

[JrZook]

Was that directly from the coil? If so then you can eliminate the dizzy cap and leads. Since you have replaced the coil and ignitor already then it could be narrowed down to the source voltage to the coil or the ignitor triggering circuit..

[Blakey]

JrZook wrote:

Well to check that weak spark see if you can just clobber something together to test how far it can jump without shocking yourself. The breakdown voltage for an air gap of 1cm between 2 electrodes is roughly 30kV. Stock stuff should be able to jump that. Also check the voltage at the coil. Should be very close to the battery voltage.

its 33kV for 10mm on round electrodes, it can be much less to as little as 10kV per 10mm for different electrode shapes, and example being a jacobs ladder. which can use as little as 9kV.

but at higher pressures the dilectric strength of air is greaty increased. and 30kV could go as little as 1mm