[SuziBlu]

Gwagensteve wrote:

Alternator looks to be the problem there Chris, not so much the battery. My EF/EL alt will hold 14.5v with all lights etc on.

Steve

Alternator, or voltage regulator ?

[Gwagensteve]

Alternator.

[christover1]

Looks like we have a short somewhere in the car.
Battery still at 12.7, same as at 8, 10 and now 11.30.
Disconnected charge wire at battery, no short there.
With earth only on battery reconnected, test light on battery positive terminal
test light comes on when using the positive battery lead as earth for light.
Now to start hunting for a short.

Is hopefully an easy find/fix

[Gwagensteve]

I might be misunderstanding something, but that's just normal, it's no evidence of a short. In any case if you had a short you'd have smoke and flames.

You need to measure amps flowing with the key out of the ignition, as per Royce.

Steve.

[royce]

yep we need to go looking for current draw

does your multimeter have a 0-10amp current setting?

if so we want to leave the battery unplugged and one lead goes to the battery terminal and the other to the cable that connects to it, so the meter is in series in the circuit.
Then see what we get for current, I reckon we will see a little under an amp.
If so dont turn anything on! but unplg things that are wired to battery power, start with the interior light fuse, this will kill the ECU power and the radio, then check things like CB radios if wired that way, aux outlets etc etc

if something makes a decent drop, its a problem.


you could also try hooking it back up and continue to monitor the voltage, might be before you abttery wasnt fully charged due to some short trips etc, it is really hard to charge a battery in a car believe it or not.

[christover1]

I only thought I'd disconnected charge wire, I hadn't.
So alternator earth leak is possible???
Have had that once before.
Enough flow to light my test light.

If I did it right, amp meter shows 0.2 amps flowing into battery cable,
with all wires removed.
I disconnected trailer, just in case it was my recent wiring.

Also one brown wire connected to positive terminal earths out when spotties switch is on,
and not when off.(didn't do this wiring myself)
None of my accessories wires normally connected to positive have any current.

Got to go out (on foot) so rest will have to wait.

[christover1]

Gwagensteve wrote:

I might be misunderstanding something, but that's just normal, it's no evidence of a short. In any case if you had a short you'd have smoke and flames.

You need to measure amps flowing with the key out of the ignition, as per Royce.

Steve.

I thought anything connected to the positive terminal should have no connection to earth?
But don't know for sure.

May not be a problem, but rather find out now, than out in the bush.

[royce]

.2 amps could be enough to run the battery flat in a week of nil use, perhaps somebody else with a vit might be able to check theirs to compare.

Your test light just shows there is current flowing, we already know this

An alternator can drain a bit, keep your meter hooked up for current and pull the charge wire off and see if it changes

If you cant find the culprit and dont plan on leaving it parked for any long amount of time then I dont think its worth spending money on for now, at least we have proven you dont need to get a new battery or alternator just yet.

[jono165]

Gwagensteve wrote:

You're not that lucky. Optimas are dear even at cost.

Steve

I bought my Optima at cost through my uncle who used to work for a company that sells batteries. I paid $229 for a D34 yellow top. On ebay at the time there were some for around the $250 mark. I think RRP for a D34 is around the $400 mark. I'm interested to see how many years I get out of it compared to a normal battery.

Most places that have cheap optimas import them directly from the US, bypassing the Australian Distributor.

[christover1]

I will check alt when home. And the wirings. But can live with not perfect. I will relax soon

[christover1]

0.2 could be the immobiliser or something innocent

[christover1]

Thank you everyone for all your help.

Not perfect is fine by me.
Not running any important big users of power most of the time.
And LED and other low useage gear is getting cheaper now.

I know I can rely on it for now.
Till I get round to the 110 upgrade.
So will put it back together with a good clean of contacts for now.

I just need to drive it more.
I have been sick, and saving money, so car has sat more often than usual.

[royce]

Do you park near power? you might want to consider a tender charger like a Ctek if you normally dont drive it every day, then you can leave it plugged in and it will keep it topped up

The 2nd bonus is it will look after the battery better than an alternator so the battery will last a lot longer, they are $100 or so though.

[christover1]

Just checked battery before reassembly.
Down to 12.35 since I been out.
So an optima may still happen, but no hurry.

But I'm an idiot.

Earth terminal had a crack part way through, that I only just noticed.
Cleaning it made it obvious.
I've dodgied it, and cleaned everything connected to battery.
That has improved it already by half a V

So new terminals tomorrow, or soon.

I was testing Volts on battery and on the terminals,
expecting that to show if a poor connection existed.

[royce]

You will only see a difference in voltage across a connection if thre is also current flowing

Clean terminals are good terminals, for every .1 volt you can get back when charging, thats more resting capacity in the battery and the more its charged the longer it will live.

[Built4thrashing]

Got a price on a D51 Optima. I can get them for around $220 each from a local supplier of 12volt equipment and 12v solar panels...
Not sure if he post.

[christover1]

$225 with free delivery on ebay is the best I have found.
Most are between $230 and $250

[christover1]

royce wrote:

You will only see a difference in voltage across a connection if thre is also current flowing

Clean terminals are good terminals, for every .1 volt you can get back when charging, thats more resting capacity in the battery and the more its charged the longer it will live.

Got 2 shiny new terminals now, and some emery board,
everything get done properly tomorrow.

I got a 14.4V reading at low revs once already.


I feel more educated now, thanks again everyone.

Need to add me to the dick head thread

[royce]

no n

christover1 wrote:

I got a 14.4V reading at low revs once already.

christover1 wrote:

I feel more educated now, thanks again everyone.

Need to add me to the dick head thread

No need for dickhead thread here, lots of people would of gone gee battery feels and bit flat, gone and blown some money, achieved nothing and still wouldn't know what it all meant when it still didn't work

[christover1]

It fixed my trailer reverse camera issue,
which was what led me to start suspecting battery.
When I would brake, or turn on anything, rev cam would go dead.
It stays on now.
Its a wireless, and the transmitter or reciever needed enough power for a good signal.

Made me learn how to use my multimeter properly, too.
All win

Was tempted to make hasty purchases or works,
as I got a few hospital visits, and little time leading up to the next trip.
I will be more relaxed in the hospital now, knowing everything is ready to travel.

[royce]

Amazing that such a little change in Voltage will make something like that go bung but the engine still cranks

[christover1]

Is charging at 14.4 under nearly all conditions now

Battery still dropping to 12.4 to 12.6 area overnight.
Even after very long drives.
And noticed the negartve post is damaged.
So I ordered a new battery anyway, for peace of mind.
Thanks all.

[Gwagensteve]

As an aside, I was playing with my clamp meter just then.

With 400W of high beam/driving lights on, and the rest of the car's normal power needs met, the alternator was delivering 37.3A to meet demand. Bear in mind I have never seen a stock G16B alternator deliver over 46A at 3000rpm and you can see why I don't think the vitara alternator is up to the job.

Steve.

[christover1]

I am slowly replacing my lighting with LED's where possible.
And anything I add to wiring will be as low wattage as possible.
LED technology is improving things for older cars.
My 10 Watt reverse light is way brighter and better spread than the 50 watt halogen it replaced.

[royce]

I can also confirm with a stock alternator, normal efi vit stuff and 400w of lights and a large stereo they don't keep up on the highway

Steve, chuck the clamp meter on something with a normal battery in it and see how little the current into the battery is when charging.