[luke3411]

Hey all. Shep was telling me that there is a guy on here that makes spring spacers and might be able to give me some info. Sheps got some 30mm springs spacers for me but before I take them he said that 30mm lift in the back with spacers is not the same as 30mm spacers in the front. I'm not that mechanically savvy so I wouldn't have a clue. what would I be looking at?

[Fatzook]

His name is Bruce.

I actually sell his spacers too.

As for the lift thing, because the front strut is approximately half way between the chassis and the hub, a spacer of any given size will net approximatly twice as much lift at the wheel.

This is why a 30mm spacer kit consists of 2x 30mm spacers (rear), and 2x 15mm spacers (front)

Clear as mud?

[luke3411]

Cool. How much is your kits?

[atari4x4]

Fatzook wrote:

His name is Bruce.

I actually sell his spacers too.

As for the lift thing, because the front spring is approximately half way between the chassis and the hub, a spacer of any given size will net approximatly twice as much lift at the wheel.

This is why a 30mm spacer kit consists of 2x 30mm spacers (rear), and 2x 15mm spacers (front)

Clear as mud?

fixed

[GV6]

Got some front 15mm spacers from Bruce this week, very speedy service, thanks Bruce !

[1DYX]

deleted comment to avoid further confusion....

[Bruce]

This is only for Vitara/Grand. Coily is 1:1 so 30mm spacer on front of a coily will raise it 30mm
Clear as mud

[GV6]

Fatzook wrote:

As for the lift thing, because the front strut is approximately half way between the chassis and the hub, a spacer of any given size will net approximatly twice as much lift at the wheel.

This is why a 30mm spacer kit consists of 2x 30mm spacers (rear), and 2x 15mm spacers (front)

After fitting the 15mm front spacer I only got 16mm lift (2003 GV which has the spring 1/2 way from the fulcrum to the hub).

Spring was re-fitted on the wishbone exactly where it was previous to the addition of the coil spacer, maybe the angle of the wishbone being >90 deg reduces the actual lift obtained ???

Has anybody else actually got 30mm lift from a 15mm front spacer on this model GV ?

[Fatzook]

Is your strut limiting travel?

[Brett]

Did you put your spring rubbers back in as we'll?

[GV6]

Brett : yes original rubber spring seats went in between spacer and top of spring.

FZ : struts appear ok, i have approx 3 inch droop available on each side, car rides through gutters and flexes ok so i guess they're ok.
(they are brand new dobinson struts, with brand new dobinson -042 front springs)

maybe i need to have a good look at wishbone rubbers, they don't look that bad but it may be a contributing factor.
Are people replacing wishbone bushes on GV's at 160k km ?

[vitzookman]

Did you put the new springs in at the same time or were they in already?

If the spring went in at the same time how much lift did u get?

[GV6]

vitzookman wrote:

Did you put the new springs in at the same time or were they in already?

If the spring went in at the same time how much lift did u get?

Fitted springs and struts first, wasn't happy with front lift, then fitted spring spacer, still didn't get the lift i expected from spacer (which i too thought would be proportional to the distance from the fulcrum to the wheel hub).


measurements from bottom of 16" rim to bottom of mudguard after 100km driving to allow springs to settle were,

after fitting just new springs :

front left 694mm
front right 689mm


then after fitting 15mm spring spacer :
front left 710mm
front right 705mm

[got_bar_work]

Whats the coil look like
Does it have a big bow in it
If it does that could be robbing u a little bit of lift

[GV6]

got_bar_work wrote:

Whats the coil look like
Does it have a big bow in it
If it does that could be robbing u a little bit of lift

Coil has a slight bow at normal ride height, must be a combination of wishbone angle and wishbone bush eccentricity.

Guess I'll have to be happy with where it sits at present, at least until I replace the wishbones (which will best be done when i replace the CV's).

[got_bar_work]

Try turning ur coil till the end of the wire on the bottem sit out near the wheel

[Built4thrashing]

For a comparison....

In my V6 LWB GV i have 40mm King Spring with 15mm spacers and 2 sets of original rubbers i get 701mm RHS and 725mm LHS and thats with an Alloy bar, winch and a dual Battery under the bonnet.


Measurements were done in the dark on a sloping driveway so may not be 100% accurate.

[GV6]

got_bar_work wrote:

Try turning ur coil till the end of the wire on the bottem sit out near the wheel

I can see your thought, but not feeling comfortable with the spring not sitting in its proper location point.

Built4thrashing wrote:

For a comparison....

In my V6 LWB GV i have 40mm King Spring with 15mm spacers and 2 sets of original rubbers i get 701mm RHS and 725mm LHS and thats with an Alloy bar, winch and a dual Battery under the bonnet.


Measurements were done in the dark on a sloping driveway so may not be 100% accurate.

Comparison is helpful, thankyou.

My extra front weight is JML bar (no winch), auto Trans cooler, maybe 23kg all up.


Doesn't look like we actually get 30mm out of a 15mm coil spacer tho does it ?

[vitzookman]

The more lift the less the ratio ( 1-2 ) I believe but the light bulb moment is the Bull Bar

[atari4x4]

i always thought it was more like a 1:1.75 ratio rather than the whole 1:2.

[Bruce]

atari4x4 wrote:

i always thought it was more like a 1:1.75 ratio rather than the whole 1:2.

That's about right.

[GV6]

vitzookman wrote:

The more lift the less the ratio ( 1-2 ) I believe but the light bulb moment is the Bull Bar

Sorry I mustn't have described the chronological order of things clearly.

The bull bar was on prior to the spring change and spacer addition, so weights are exactly the same before and after (the reason i mentioned the bar was for weight comparison to B4T's heights).

I agree that the further above a 90 degree angle the wishbone is compared to the spring, the less that any lift ratio would apply.


Lets say the wheel to spring lift ratio is conservatively 1.7:1 x 15mm spacer = 25.5mm lift (without including angular loss).


If i account say 2mm less lift at spring for wishbone bush eccentricity, that would equal approx 3.4mm less lift at wheel = approx 22mm lift

Since i actually get 16mm lift from the spacer (all other weights etc are equal), I am losing 6mm or 27% of the 22mm lift due to wishbone angle, seems alot considering the angle is not huge but may be feasible.


Haven't seen anybody elses before and after front coil spacer measurements to confirm or deny the above theory, but i doubt anyone will get a 30mm lift from a 15mm spacer.

Calling them 30mm lift is probably not as accurate as most people want when they are buying suspension parts, in my opinion they probably should call the front coil spacer a 15 to 25mm lift depending on geometry.

[Chop]

Ok mine has been back together since just before easter, and has settled and i've just had my camber readjusted.
I installed along with my new control arms, new dobinson springs 042's to take the weight of the bar,winch, and second battery.
Even before that weight was added the original dobinsons 034's had sagged dipping the car down at the front, even more with the weight and with the 15mm spacers.
So i added a 20mm upfront when i put the new front end in. I now have 735mm from the bottom of rim to guard.

[GV6]

Chop wrote:

Ok mine has been back together since just before easter, and has settled and i've just had my camber readjusted.
I installed along with my new control arms, new dobinson springs 042's to take the weight of the bar,winch, and second battery.
Even before that weight was added the original dobinsons 034's had sagged dipping the car down at the front, even more with the weight and with the 15mm spacers.
So i added a 20mm upfront when i put the new front end in. I now have 735mm from the bottom of rim to guard.

Can you please clarify, is your total front spacer 20mm or 35mm (15mm + 20mm) ?

Are your springs located in the proper location point on the wishbone or rotated out like got bar work suggested ?

Are your control arms standard with standard bushes (and where did you source these, looks like i may need a set) ?

[Chop]

20mm spacer only, spring in correct position.
I replaced the control arms with stock ones, only because i had a dodgy balljoint and unfortunetly they are part of the control arm and not a removable item. And with the big trip coming up i didn't want a fail.
I got them from the U.S.

[GV6]

Thanks chop for the info.

The wishbone bushes on mine may be providing more of the lost lift than I expect. Will be interesting to see how much difference replacing them makes in future.

[Chop]

The bushes looked good on my 03 with 160 on the clock.