[tonyevans]

OK - I am fitting a full ECB bull bar and bash plate to my 1998 2.5lt SQ625 that has standard suspension and would like to know what the options are to beef it up a little for the extra weight?

It is NOT an off road as in sport, just to tow my camper trailer on some dirt roads to western river camp spots so nothing extreme (read expensive) is needed.

Suggestions please

[GeckoXL7]

King Springs would be ok for that about 330 for all 4, they only start sagging as soon as a heavey winch goes on.

I would go dobinson front struts, mainly cause there a good length and provide a nice ride and not badly priced.

With this will give you a decent height around 35 - 40mm and provide a nice ride.

I also tow a camper and the rear springs hardly compress ride is quite stable.

If want to spend a bit more, go all dobs, their springs will provide a higher ride height and prob a bit more load handling. May be able to buy from them direct at a good price. I think all up it was around 440 for all 4 springs 220 a pair, was quoted a while ago so memory is a bit vague.

[atari4x4]

i'd hit dank up @ kpd4x4 & see what he can do in dobinson, they've got a heap of different spring rates. i'd definitely factor in new front struts & rear springs, could bring the front up with a coil spacer from Bruce & find a rear shock to suit, eg camira etc etc if you want to do it on a budget.

[tonyevans]

OK Gus - educate me - Why do I need new REAR shocks if I put in FRONT Spacers?

[atari4x4]

suzuki tightarseness... new rear springs to get the height & take the added weight of the camper & rear shocks to suit. then bung a coil spacer & stock coils in the front to bring the height up while still keeping a relatively softly sprung front end & use an extended length strut from OME, dobinson or ironman to get a decent strut under there.

[tonyevans]

I don't need extra height just compensate for the bar weight? It's all flat out here where I go

[GeckoXL7]

Is it a ECB Aloy bar as it might not even effect the ride that much, i got my car with a ECB aloy bar then put on a bash plate it was pretty much exactly the same as stock and went decently off road, Did sand dunes and even Arden hills stock, might of got a few dents in the bottom but did it so you prob will be ok.

If really want beafier, would just throw in a set of either just front king springs or all 4. and dob shocks, if want cheaper than dob Drivetech from repco are actually very good shocks got them in the car now and outlasted any other shocks i have had, on par with dobs with ride. Verry good with corrugations just soaks them up, my kids cant make that humming noise going over corrugations like they use too.

[atari4x4]

tonyevans wrote:

I don't need extra height just compensate for the bar weight? It's all flat out here where I go

Yeah but the upgraded rear spring will give you some lift no matter what, the spacers in the front are only to level it out as it will drive & look funny with the arse jacked up in the air...

How big/heavy is your camper trailer & how does the current set up cope with it when loaded up?

[tonyevans]

Gecko - Thanks for that info - I will wait till I have fitted the bar and see how it goes then.

Gus - I only know my camper is there if I look in the mirror - it was the extra weight of the bar on the front I was concerned with.

[droverdave]

What is the actual weight of the new bar? and remember you are taking the old bar off which will reduce the weight increase.

[GeckoXL7]

ECB Bar is around 40 KG, alloy bash plate is around 10kg

[droverdave]

50kg hey. So you got two springs, dunno what the spring rate would be, shall we take a conservative guess at 4kg/mm. So 25kg a side, thats around 6mm drop overall.

This does not take into account you removing the original front bar (ie losing weight) , so worst case is 6mm drop or so, but definitely less.

Is less than 6mm worth worrying about? Surely you'd be flat out even measuring that.

(note this doesn't take into account the wheel rate, but i think for this purpose its pretty good guesstimate)

[henno]

Chuck a 10mm spacer in there. Done.

[GeckoXL7]

If the bar does affect the ride and dont want the hassel of taking the springs out there are always these as a option as well
I have been bagged many times on here about them saying they will be like welding coils together or stiffen up the spring to much. But i have prefered them being in, have them both front and rear.

It does increase the spring load rate but does not effect ride quality the rubber absorbs alot of road vibrations etc. eg the ride is more harsh with them out which kinda if think about it doesnt make sense apart from the rubber absorbs shock etc. You gain around 5-10mm, you can gain slightly more height if positoin it at the top of the spring where it tends to compress more.

http://www.springassisters.co.uk/menu.htm

Can get them off ebay or some online stores. Verry easy to install, just need to jack the car up so wheels are of the ground, measure the distance of gap between two coils and order the right size, to install again just jack it up spray some wd40 or put some oil on the spring and push them in, once in you can rotate them so they go up and down the spring.

[tonyevans]

Thanks guys - Lots to look at so I will wait to see what happens with the car when I fit the bar.

[zoukshin]

my .02; got the same car (albeit 2004) with the same bar and plate. Got dobs. does the trick. Added some weight with a second battery and other bits. Still fine. Don't forget camber bolts if you go that way.

[got_bar_work]

Take the spring out
Take the rubber seat off
Cut a spacer out of conveyor belt
Put it on the coil seat
Then the rubber seat then the coil
Should give u about 10-15 mm lift to make up for the bar

[fordem]

droverdave wrote:

This does not take into account you removing the original front bar (ie losing weight)

What front bar?? Have you ever seen the front bar? It's a plastic skin over a relatively small folded box section that weighs about as much as the plastic skin (it gets it's strength because it's boxed)

[fordem]

GeckoXL7 wrote:

If the bar does affect the ride and dont want the hassel of taking the springs out there are always these as a option as well
I have been bagged many times on here about them saying they will be like welding coils together or stiffen up the spring to much. But i have prefered them being in, have them both front and rear.

It does increase the spring load rate but does not effect ride quality the rubber absorbs alot of road vibrations etc. eg the ride is more harsh with them out which kinda if think about it doesnt make sense apart from the rubber absorbs shock etc. You gain around 5-10mm, you can gain slightly more height if positoin it at the top of the spring where it tends to compress more.

http://www.springassisters.co.uk/menu.htm

Can get them off ebay or some online stores. Verry easy to install, just need to jack the car up so wheels are of the ground, measure the distance of gap between two coils and order the right size, to install again just jack it up spray some wd40 or put some oil on the spring and push them in, once in you can rotate them so they go up and down the spring.

Install at your own risk - as far as I'm concerned those will simply hasten the destruction of your existing springs due to the fact that they load the unsupported section more than the supported section - and I could be wrong but the last time I looked under my GV I didn't see a progressively wound spring so the bottom is going to compress just as much as the top with any given change in ride height.

One last thing - you can't change the spring rate without affecting the ride quality - think about it - you increase the spring rate, it's stiffer - decrease the spring rate it's softer - increase the spring rate to compensate for increased loading with no change in damping, you get more oscillation (up/down movement) - increase the spring rate without an increased load will result in less oscillation.

[atari4x4]

^^^ gecko is all about the gimmicks.

fordem wrote:

droverdave wrote:

This does not take into account you removing the original front bar (ie losing weight)

What front bar?? Have you ever seen the front bar? It's a plastic skin over a relatively small folded box section that weighs about as much as the plastic skin (it gets it's strength because it's boxed)

standard front bar & reinforcing on a SV vitara is 14kgs... can't see the GV one being much more.

[GeckoXL7]

^^^^ I like to try things, whats wrong with that?

They are actually quite soft so give support but will compress if need. and i know its weird but the ride is better with them in. after new shocks it was quite harsh so took them out for a bit, going over corrigations was a fair bit more harsh, put them back in it softened out a bit. Goes against logic i know but thats my experiance. I only put it as a alternative as i had no issues what so ever with them.

I really dont think fitting the aloy bar will make much of a noticable difference to worry about.

[Sco-tie]

mine had the alloy bar on stock springs and struts etc for nearly 10yrs no problems...