[kemlar]

Trying to find the plug to put the paperclip in for fault code reading, or do I need an obd reader?

I have a 2003 Grand Vitara 2.5 v6 auto.

It's having a problem when you first start it after a nights rest. It takes longer to crank over , but always starts and runs good. Then after its warm start straight away.

Have done all the usual things:

Battery is good
Spark plugs are gapped and New.
Fuel filter is new.
Air filter is new.
Tried injector cleaner, checked they are working. have not got them serviced yet. (Maybe)?

Drives good and fuel economy is all good.

Thought I might check if there are any codes.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

[fordem]

Is the check engine light on? If it's not, the paperclip method won't get you any results.

[kemlar]

No check engine light. Ok so I will need a obd reader to read if there is any history codes.

For future reference any chance you could could point me in the direction of where the plug might be on my gv for the paperclip?

[murcod]

I could be wrong, but I don't think the later models have the plug for shorting to read the codes? You could also have historical codes stored that aren't currently active - they won't cause the CEL to stay illuminated AFAIK.

You might need something like a SDT or X431 Idiag to read the codes. Your model won't be OBD2 compliant so don't waste your money buying a generic reader.

[kemlar]

Ok cool. I thought that might be the case. Might look at getting a x431 Idiag.

I have read a few posts on here with the same problem as mine but there hasn't been a conclusion exactly to what they fixed.

Thanks heaps for the info.

[GeckoXL7]

Cold starting issue's.

Try turning the Key just to on for 20-30seconds on a cold morning first time then try cranking.. (this will give a bit of time for 02 sensors to self heat, etc) sometimes works for me.

Could be fuel pressure related eg fuel pressure regulator not holding the pressure which makes it difficult to start, after starting the car will still run fine as it regulates the pressure but when starting it doesnt let the fuel lines built enough pressure to assist starting the car... This is just a stab at the problem. One way to check this is TUrn the ign to on listen for the pump you should only hear it for a few seconds, turn ign off, wait 10seconds then turn back on you should only hear the fuel pump for a second or two as there is already pressure in the line. When mine played up it made a high pitched farting noise as it couldn't hold the initial pressure.

But i idiag will help you look at anything that may not be running right or faults that may be stored.

[kemlar]

Yeah it's not when it is cold outside. It's 34 degrees here at the moment. Just when it's left overnight and then first start. After first start, it starts like normal.

Fuel pump is working, well I can here it... I tried turning it on listen for the fuel pump to stop, then turn off then do it again a few times to see if it does anything different, but doesn't help any.

My thoughts were if maybe my injector/s are dirty and maybe not atomizing properly for a good ignition. Then when it's been warmed up after first start it is easier to restart because of it already being hot?
It doesn't run rough or have bad fuel economy so maybe just not blocked bad yet..?

I'm no mechanic is the fuel pressure regulator a sensor? And is it easy to get to and replace so I could rule that out.

If a injector needs new kit put through would that also be a pressure problem then on first start?

[GeckoXL7]

The fuel pressure regulator is pictured bellow top right with the yellow vacuum hose going to it. its on the outlet of the fuel injector rail, it keeps the fuel pressure at 35psi but also changes with vacuum.
This valve should hold the fuel pressure if it doesn't the car can be hard to start if it hasn't been started in a while.



Its just a stab at the problem, as you have new sparkplugs, fuel economy is good etc. IF blocked injectors, it either idles rough or get bad fuel economy.

Since car runs well after its first started, seems to be a fuel pressure issue but i could be wrong.

Dirty MAF can cause starting issues too, but the engine norm idles rough when its dirty.

[kemlar]

Ok cool. Sounds like I was thinking in the right direction at first.
Can I spray the maf sensor with electrical cleaner, or do I need that mad sensor cleaner?

Also I guess I should get the fuel pressure checked with a gauge. That would tell me if I need to replace the regulator I guess. Cause it looks like that would be a factory part which mean $$$.

[GeckoXL7]

Could use electrical cleaner if pure isopropyle alchohole. But prob best to use maf cleaner .

Norm the fuel pump check when turn it first on is enough to check pressure and pressure hold.


Just checked my car that's been off all weekend. First time turning to on the fuel pump stayed on for 5 seconds. Turned off waited 20 seconds turned back to on the pump stayed on for 3seconds. There was a max time in manual somewhere but can't find it. Regulator for oem is around 100 but if you can test fuel pressure go for it. The tester will have to be connected on inlet pipe the larger of the two on the front top left of motor.

At start which engine off should be 38 to 44 psi at idle 29 to 37 after one minute of being turned off should drop to 28psi and very slowly lose pressure

[kemlar]

Awesome good information. I will try the fuel pump and listen for how long it goes for.
I think my work has a fuel pressure gauge will hit them up for it. Might grab some maf spray. Just to be sure.

Thanks heaps for trouble shooting. Will get back with my findings.

[Aferal]

Where is the Cel plug on the grand vitaras v6 manual 1999. Got the check engine light, illuminated on mine plus its not runing right.
Thanks Feral