[ChinoSQ]

Guys n Gals!,

Im planning on spending some cash on my suzi and thought id grace the world with some pics and follow up page. Ive thought about buying a new hilux or pajero or something of the like and i just cant seem to part with the suzuki. So the plan is to build her up... something reliable and go anywhere beast. I have a great starting block because the current shape of the car ia near on perfect. Will post pics as i go along

I also need some help on some sites (maybe for the US) where i can buy custom 4wd gear. Diff lockers... suspension gear..

Also places where i can sort the 5spd gear box and transfer.. custom tailshaft Make n it a little tuffer etc. Oh and one more.. i need advice on engine conversion/crate engine/forged rebuild. Looking to make a little weopon. Its pretty much a fun car to go everywhere in and smash the dunes in..

Pics to come as soon as i work out the uploading pics debacle (rims on their way and suspension and barwork ordered)

Your bud dan

[ChinoSQ]

The beast as it now stands

[swifty_ano]

All depends on your intended purposes.

Your gearing is dependent on yours plans, tire size and type of driving?
Just like your gearing, your tire size will be dictated by tyre size and type of driving.

[klutched]

Motor - http://www.importperformanceparts.net/i ... uzuki.html
Lots of places for suspension
Air lockers - ARB Front RD208, Rear RD209 (Will need vitara rear carrier)

[ChinoSQ]

klutched wrote:

Motor - http://www.importperformanceparts.net/i ... uzuki.html
Lots of places for suspension
Air lockers - ARB Front RD208, Rear RD209 (Will need vitara rear carrier)

Awesome info man, although not the biggest fan of wiseco gear.. probably be ok for what i want.. which is just a sand demon. I think standard compression and supercharged would be nice! Could even do a few dirt drags in it for a laugh haha

Also dude, do you know with the arb diff lockers are they a straight swap out or do they work in with the original diff. Like are they centres? Not sure how it works.. i have had race cars with 2 way difff centres. Mainly just want a driveline to handle the extra power and force placed on it.

[klutched]

Yeah arb lockers are a center replacement. If you plan to just make it a beach/road rig, I think the driveline may handle it. When you start throwing big tyres and hitting hard terrain is where you'll find it's limit and fast. If you're sensible though it can last.

[ChinoSQ]

klutched wrote:

Yeah arb lockers are a center replacement. If you plan to just make it a beach/road rig, I think the driveline may handle it. When you start throwing big tyres and hitting hard terrain is where you'll find it's limit and fast. If you're sensible though it can last.

Yeah cool.. im sure there a company out there that can strengthen the box a bit surely.. to keep up with the extra torque cant wait to get home from work to install this lift haha

Do you or does anyone know if the 2.5 v6 has 4 or 6 or 8 bolt mains etc??

Just determining whether i will need a metal head gasket to drop compression to save the head peeling off

[klutched]

8 bolt mains???

Are you planning to turbo or supercharge it? Wiseco offers different compressions for their pistons so you can go lower or higher.

[fordem]

ChinoSQ wrote:

Do you or does anyone know if the 2.5 v6 has 4 or 6 or 8 bolt mains etc??

You'll find it's a little different to what you're thinking of - the block does not have individual main bearing caps - it is a "two piece" block split horizontally along the crankshaft axis, with the crank located in between the two sections - there are sixteen bolts holding the two sections together.

Take a quick trip over to the Suzuki forums at www.suzuki-forums.com and you'll find a sticky in the GV section with a link to a soft copy of the FSM.

[ChinoSQ]

klutched wrote:

8 bolt mains???

Are you planning to turbo or supercharge it? Wiseco offers different compressions for their pistons so you can go lower or higher.

Not sure really.. i think a twin turbo kit would be the go.. but i think a supercharger would be more simple and would cost less..

From what ive read the h25a has a fair bit of potential.. due to a 1000hp h25a do9ng hill climbs haha so will just see whats possible..

[ChinoSQ]

fordem wrote:

ChinoSQ wrote:

Do you or does anyone know if the 2.5 v6 has 4 or 6 or 8 bolt mains etc??

You'll find it's a little different to what you're thinking of - the block does not have individual main bearing caps - it is a "two piece" block split horizontally along the crankshaft axis, with the crank located in between the two sections - there are sixteen bolts holding the two sections together.

Take a quick trip over to the Suzuki forums at http://www.suzuki-forums.com and you'll find a sticky in the GV section with a link to a soft copy of the FSM.

Hmm yeah right, well i wonder with that setup how well its hold up under boost

[fordem]

Think of it as a crank girdle - and as for well it holds up - the 2.7 V6, which is essentially the same design has been pushed to I believe 980+ bhp - google Monster Tajima and you're sure to find something about it.

[Gwagensteve]

I'm a little put puzzled about the direction of this build.

A GV is a relatively heavy car that can only accept small tyres and has marginal driveline strength. Whilst it might be lighter than larger midsize 4WD's, it also has weaker driveline and less scope for tyre size.

If this is an engine building project primarily, then go for your life. The driveline will be the limiting factor, but so kong as you're aware of that then that's cool.

If the point of the project is a car that performs well on sand, starting with a lighter car, even with the high performance 2.5 V6 fitted, would be preferable, so too would a car that allows a larger tyre.

If you achieve (and can cool) 300hp, the rest of the driveline won't take it. Add larger tyres and that problem will only get worse.

I would also have started with an auto if you were chasing sand performance, especially with a turbo motor. Loosing boost on shifts will be an issue if you're actually providing the motor with any load.

If it was my build for sand I'd be gutting the car to lower weight as much as possible, working the guards to accept something like a 33 10.5 using land cruiser or patrol rear diff and throw everything possible at the front end. I'd run an LS V8, 4L65E from a donor commodore and patrol or hilux transfer. The major cost item is really only the transfer adapter and the driveline will be reliable and won't grenade. Overall cost would be under the cost of building, boosting and cooling a H25 before you try and get the rest of the driveline to accept the torque.

Just my thoughts.

Steve.

[Gwagensteve]

PS if you run a rear end to accept a 31-33" tyre on a 15" rim you can then run paddles for the sand, which would then give a turbo motor something to work against.

[ChinoSQ]

Gwagensteve wrote:

I'm a little put puzzled about the direction of this build.

A GV is a relatively heavy car that can only accept small tyres and has marginal driveline strength. Whilst it might be lighter than larger midsize 4WD's, it also has weaker driveline and less scope for tyre size.

If this is an engine building project primarily, then go for your life. The driveline will be the limiting factor, but so kong as you're aware of that then that's cool.

If the point of the project is a car that performs well on sand, starting with a lighter car, even with the high performance 2.5 V6 fitted, would be preferable, so too would a car that allows a larger tyre.

If you achieve (and can cool) 300hp, the rest of the driveline won't take it. Add larger tyres and that problem will only get worse.

I would also have started with an auto if you were chasing sand performance, especially with a turbo motor. Loosing boost on shifts will be an issue if you're actually providing the motor with any load.

If it was my build for sand I'd be gutting the car to lower weight as much as possible, working the guards to accept something like a 33 10.5 using land cruiser or patrol rear diff and throw everything possible at the front end. I'd run an LS V8, 4L65E from a donor commodore and patrol or hilux transfer. The major cost item is really only the transfer adapter and the driveline will be reliable and won't grenade. Overall cost would be under the cost of building, boosting and cooling a H25 before you try and get the rest of the driveline to accept the torque.

Just my thoughts.

Steve.

Heavy car? Its 1400kgs? Thats light as fuck for a 4wd am i not correct? I didnt want to go over board with the tyres as im not looking to do much mud.. and if youndo a bit of reading, tyre size isnt the biggest factor with sand driving albeit the tyres i have are alot wider than standard (will update with exact sizes)

Your right about the automatic gearbox i know.. i just enjoy the manual and thatd what i will use for now. Auto may b an option in the future.. i have spoken to ppg and they can sort me a custom gearset and tailshaft once and when they self destruct tough diffs can be sorted, clutch.. and other things to just replace when they break.

Surely if the h25 is used in hillclimb races (suzuki escudo that monster tajima raced). And i may go a supercharger still.

Not saying you could get the engine to do magical things but surely it has some promise? Anyway. One step at a time.. suspension first and go from there.

Really all i want is a super tough dune buggy for up at lancelin and some beachy camping trips..

EDIT - tyres are 31s i think 255/75 16 inch

[ChinoSQ]

Gwagensteve wrote:

PS if you run a rear end to accept a 31-33" tyre on a 15" rim you can then run paddles for the sand, which would then give a turbo motor something to work against.

Thanks mate... will keep that in mind haha paddles would b sick

[Gwagensteve]

I guess you mean 265/75/16? yes, basically a little over 31" or about a 17% increase from stock. Keep an eye on load rating, lots of 265's have a high load rating and this will hurt sand performance.

If your car ends up at 1400kg you will be doing very well, I suspect 1650 will be closer to the figure it ends up at once you're actually driving it on the dunes. Whilst that's lighter than most 4WD's, some of that "low" weight is being achieved through small/light driveline components that aren't designed for the power figures you're implying your engine will make. Sure, you can upgrade all this stuff and then the car gets heavier so your power to weight goes down

The GV driveline is marginal with 31" tyres and stock power output.

You're also gearing the car up. you'll need to drop to lower diff ratios to compensate for the bigger tyres, and you'll also want to look at where the new engine is making power and work that into the gearing equation. I guess whether you supercharge or not will have the biggest bearing on this.

The tailshaft and gearset will be fine. Axles, transfer, and, well, everything in the front end, are going to be where your problems lie. If you drive enthusiastically, these problems will arise with stock power at your planned tyre size.

As I run a vitara rear diff in my car (and I'm planning a vitara rear for the front) I'm pretty interested about how you are strengthening the GV diffs. You could be onto something many of us would be interested in.

[ChinoSQ]

Gwagensteve wrote:

I guess you mean 265/75/16? yes, basically a little over 31" or about a 17% increase from stock. Keep an eye on load rating, lots of 265's have a high load rating and this will hurt sand performance.

If your car ends up at 1400kg you will be doing very well, I suspect 1650 will be closer to the figure it ends up at once you're actually driving it on the dunes. Whilst that's lighter than most 4WD's, some of that "low" weight is being achieved through small/light driveline components that aren't designed for the power figures you're implying your engine will make. Sure, you can upgrade all this stuff and then the car gets heavier so your power to weight goes down

The GV driveline is marginal with 31" tyres and stock power output.

You're also gearing the car up. you'll need to drop to lower diff ratios to compensate for the bigger tyres, and you'll also want to look at where the new engine is making power and work that into the gearing equation. I guess whether you supercharge or not will have the biggest bearing on this.

The tailshaft and gearset will be fine. Axles, transfer, and, well, everything in the front end, are going to be where your problems lie. If you drive enthusiastically, these problems will arise with stock power at your planned tyre size.

As I run a vitara rear diff in my car (and I'm planning a vitara rear for the front) I'm pretty interested about how you are strengthening the GV diffs. You could be onto something many of us would be interested in.

Aftermarket components are usually lighter than stock and if not then you can make up weight loss elsewhere... well from what i gathered the arb lockers are a replacement diff.. "over 100% as strong" as the website states haha front and rear.. there about 1400 each though.. i have also read of an aftermarket 'rockcrawler transfer gearset' which are a replacemt for the standard 4wd trans gears. Working it out slowly man.. end of the day it wil probably end up a trailer pog if i cant work a plan with the 2.5 and swing an ls in it... see how it goes one step at a time.

[christover1]

My Chinasoong air locker centre was much heavier than the stock centre,
so much so I could no longer lift it in by hand, had to by a trolley jack.
I could feel the drag with my little engine.
Worth considering in your plans, I assume ARB lockers be similar weight gain.

[got_bar_work]

The chains in the tc would be the weak bit not the gears
The pinion is the bit that would snap well before the center would be a problem.
Solid pinion spacer will help
The front gv diff cant handle stock power and tire . A vit diff with arb will fix it but u still have the sierra sized ring and pinion