[RobJ]

Basically, i realized it had been about 60,000km since the oil in my transmission had been changed so i decided i'd do it myself.

i first opened the level plug and found that it had previously been filled higher than recommended, then continued to finish draining it (i also cleaned the metal shaving off the drain plug magnet). I refilled it to the bottom of the level plug with Castrol protector 90w 80 gear oil and sealed it back up.

Over the course of the last 3 days i have not seen a change to 3-5 gear or reverse but 1st and 2nd have started getting nasty. I'm sure there is more resistance now putting it into either of these gears and first will occasionally grind or require force to go into gear.

What do you think is the cause of this roughness in my gears?

It is possible that the oil was slightly contaminated by the hose i used to fill it, but this would only be <5 drops of water or a couple of specks of dirt. At first i though that adding the oil must have picked up some loose metal shaving or something like that, but i thought it would have settled by now if this were the case.

Finally, what should i do? Is it worth adding slightly more oil (to get it back to the level it was at despite this being higher than recommended), Should i flush it out and start again, of should i just take it to a mechanic?
Also, am i doing any hard driving it around while in the meantime?

Any help will be greatly appreciated as it's the first time i've ever done anything to a transmission.

[joeblow]

what vehicle?.......more than likely you may have removed a shaft locating bolt rather than a fill bolt. (can happen) or maybe the banana peels came out when you drained it.

[steak_knife]

joeblow wrote:

what vehicle?.......more than likely you may have removed a shaft locating bolt rather than a fill bolt. (can happen) or maybe the banana peels came out when you drained it.

Ooo, haven`t herd that for a while.

[steak_knife]

joeblow wrote:

what vehicle?.......more than likely you may have removed a shaft locating bolt rather than a fill bolt. (can happen) or maybe the banana peels came out when you drained it.

I`m with joe, what is it? what size was the fill plug? was it a 3/8th drive ratchet type like the drain plug or a 12mm bolt?

[RobJ]

My car's a 92 Sierra. The refill and drain bolts had square holes which i used a ratchet to undo, the fill level bold was a standard bolt (12mm spanner got it off)
Also, the refill hole was higher than the level hole and i refilled until the oil started draining out of the level hole

[steak_knife]

Do you want the bad new`s or the bad new`s?
You`ve taken out a locating bolt by the sound`s, the level plug IS the fill plug .
I think your g/box need`s to come out.

P.s don`t drive it as you may do to much damage.

[Hybrid]

I thought the refill hole was the level hole. I once installed a bolt in my transmission without a washer and it stopped me selecting 5th and reverse. Are you sure everything went back together the way it came apart?

[steak_knife]

Hybrid wrote:

I thought the refill hole was the level hole. I once installed a bolt in my transmission without a washer and it stopped me selecting 5th and reverse. Are you sure everything went back together the way it came apart?

Is..

[RobJ]

i only removed and replaced 3 bolts, no chance of any washers going missing.

Thing which is throwing me is that the manual (SJ413) on page 163 talks about the transmission and replacing its gear oil, i followed their instructions doing the change. It identifies the three bolts i removed and labels them as the "oil filler plug "Oil level plug" and "Oil drain plug". For the transmission it doesn't treat the oil level plug as being the same as the oil filler plug.

For the transfer case the oil level is meant to go to the bottom of the filler plug, but the manual leads me to believe it isn't the same for the transmission as it says to remove the "leve'" p[lug rather than just the "filler" plug.

I'll upload the relevant page if i can get my scanner to work!

[steak_knife]

RobJ wrote:

i only removed and replaced 3 bolts, no chance of any washers going missing.

Thing which is throwing me is that the manual (SJ413) on page 163 talks about the transmission and replacing its gear oil, i followed their instructions doing the change. It identifies the three bolts i removed and labels them as the "oil filler plug "Oil level plug" and "Oil drain plug". For the transmission it doesn't treat the oil level plug as being the same as the oil filler plug.

For the transfer case the oil level is meant to go to the bottom of the filler plug, but the manual leads me to believe it isn't the same for the transmission as it says to remove the "leve'" p[lug rather than just the "filler" plug.

I'll upload the relevant page if i can get my scanner to work!

Please, I`d like to see that, i may be able to tell if it can be fixed in car, doubt it tho....

[RobJ]

Success!


I am 99% sure the bolts i removed match the ones indicated in the picture

[RobJ]

Whoops, that turned out to be alot bigger than i was expecting.
The page on the right is the relevant page (163)

[joeblow]

if they are the only ones you have touched i'd say the banana peels fell out. i allways set level to the fill plug on level ground.

[RobJ]

What do you mean banana peels, i assume metal shavings?

Where should i go from here

[steak_knife]

It`s an old trick to shut noisy g/box`s up so you can sell em.

P.s HOLLY CRAP THAT`S BIG!!!!

[steak_knife]

forgot to explain, put bananna peel`s in box, noise go`s SSSHhhhhhhhhhhh!

[RobJ]

So having seen the picture and accompanying instructions do you still think i did anything wrong by removing the 12mm bolt Steknig?

Any suggestions as to fixing it, at this point i'm thinking i'll add a little more oil tomorrow. Can anything go wrong if i do put in too much oil, though i would only be filling to the bottom of the refill plug?

[steak_knife]

RobJ wrote:

So having seen the picture and accompanying instructions do you still think i did anything wrong by removing the 12mm bolt Steknig?

Any suggestions as to fixing it, at this point i'm thinking i'll add a little more oil tomorrow. Can anything go wrong if i do put in too much oil, though i would only be filling to the bottom of the refill plug?

That bolt just hold the extension housing on, didn`t think thay went to oil tho, top it up to the higher plug, the one you used a ratchet on, take for a drive & see.
I don`t think you did anything wrong, but old car`s if thay could talk, you know the rest.. It is possible that it will shut up if full, but I doubt it.
Worth a try...

The top one is the level plug, I`ve never seen that 12mm bolt used as a check point..

[RobJ]

Thanks for the help guys i'll let you know how it goes tomorrow.

[zukenutter]

steknig wrote:

I`ve never seen that 12mm bolt used as a check point..[/i]

News to me too. I've always just filled to the filler plug level as well. I haven't heard the banana trick for a while. Never had the opportunity to try it. So it works??

[steak_knife]

zukenutter wrote:

steknig wrote:

I`ve never seen that 12mm bolt used as a check point..[/i]

News to me too. I've always just filled to the filler plug level as well. I haven't heard the banana trick for a while. Never had the opportunity to try it. So it works??

You wouldn`t want to keep it long. or drain the oil. It`s a cheap trick & not in a good way.

[coilyzook]

do you actually put real banana peels in the gearbox??

[ninjadaniel]

i thought banana peals was to stop diff whine, works on gearboxes too?

[MacDaddy]

Hi RobJ

I think you may have a dodgey/bad workshop manual, i just checked 2 Workshop manuals i have, one from USA, Haynes, and one from UK, Peter Russek Manuals, and BOTH say there is ONLY 2 Bolts/plugs, one for draining, one for filling, there is NO third bolt/plug !

In the diagram you scanned, Bolt/Plug number (1) and (3) are the only ones that need to be removed !
Also, in my manuals it gives oil quantities needed, Sierra 1.0 and 1.3 needs 0.8 litre of oil, Vitara 1.6 needs 1.7 litres, so if you measure the oil quantity, you dont need to check the level... However, it does say to fill to the lower edge of the Filler hole !

So whatever third bolt/plug you took out, has affected the mechanicals inside, i would get it to a Mechanic ASAP, and tell him exactly what you did... i have a feeling its gonna be expensive, as they may have to remove the gearbox to fix it now...

Goodluck

[zukenutter]

I agree MacBear. His scan of the manual looks like a genuine Suzuki manual. Must be a typo

[paulv]

Actually, the Mobil Lubricant Recommendation tool suggests a different weight oil.
A 75w-90 rather than a 80w-90.
And suggests 1.3 L is the fill capacity.

Do the gear changes get better after you have been driving a while?
After the gearbox oil has heated up?

[RobJ]

Well i topped it up to the bottom of the fill plug this morning and it has been driven about 15km since then. It felt a little bit better, 1st no longer grinds and both 1st and 2nd feel l little bit "lighter", though neither are quite as smooth as they were before the change though.

I'm not really noticing any real difference in the ease of changes between hot and cold oil.
Also, just to clarify, the "grinding" i was describing was only when putting it into gear, once it's in it's fine. So it's not the noise but the ease of the changes i want to improve on.

as for the oil, 80w 90 was what the chart recommended, would there really be much of a difference between 75w and 80w anyway?

Is there still any risk, or do you think i'm in the clear?

[royce]

not to be insulting or anything but its probably all in your head, I have always noticed its harder to shift gears with fresh oil but it goes away after a while

I am going to check the factory manual tonight on that fill plug, sounds like something suzuki would do

I would think that possibly the oil you are using isnt suited or your box is stuffed and somebody put engine oil or auto fluid in to make it shift nicer to get rid of it

[losfer]

i have seen that 12mm level bolt on many a gearbox , and i just went and checked my 88 model and it has it as well .

[paulv]

Not a major difference between a 75w- 90 and a 80w - 90 weight oil no.

Interestinlgy, I have had people comment that a specific brand and weight oil is neccessary for particular vehicle gearbox, other wise shifting is difficult.

Never heard it said about Sierra gearboxes though.