[beef13]

In all the other topics about sierra diesels most of the time it sounds as if there arent actually any upsides of putting one in a sierra.
SO, what would be the advantages and disadvantages (apart from needing stronger diffs and springs) of putting say a 2.8 hilux diesel in as opposed to a stock 1.3?

[Scrawny]

I think the main reason is weight. Diesels are really heavy as opposed to the all alloy standard motors.
The 2.8 is gonna be too heavy for a Zook but smaller diesels will work ok. The other issue is legalities, engine capacity will dictate what you can or can't use.
I do like the idea of a diesel Zook. The Americans commonly use the VW 1.9L diesel.

[shep]

that would be the 3rd worst motor that Toyota made. the other two are the
2.2 and 2.4 diesel very under powered crank bending pieces of snot.

have a look at the euro diesels they are smaller and make power more like a
petrol motor. i have seen a 1.9 vw powered sierra and it looked to be a neat
conversion and the owner reckoned that it worked well and there are kits
available for the conversion.

[gravity_powered]

Benefits would be a huge improvement in torque low down in the rev range, meaning you would be able to go much slower over rocks and ruts.
Theoretically a diesel is more fuel efficient than a petrol motor but I think compared to a Suzuki motor it wouldn't make a difference.

Disadvantages, especially with a 2.8L motor would be weight, size and smell.

A smaller turbo diesel out of a Van or a sedan would be a better idea. Even the new Grand Vitara diesel is only 1.9L.

[lump_a_charcoal]

The major disadvantage is the lack of genuine options here...

You can buy kits to use the 1.9 TD VW motor, but it doesn't appear anywhere in AUS so parts will be hard to find.

[kenn]

Keep in mind the balance of the car and the dreaded GVM monster.
If it's low down torque you want look at getting some diff gears or a twin transfer set up ..just fft..

[beef13]

alright, so the hilux diesel is out of the question due to weight (expected that anyway), but if the VW 1.9 was transplanted how would it differ offroad, eg. hill climbing, highway speeds etc.
Basically all i want to do is get a bit more guts at higher speed goin up hills, at lower speeds its fine but on the road as soon as the engine sniffs any sort of incline it whines like all hell and generally end up in 3rd. Would new gearing in the transfer case be better? and could i get low gearing for offorad as well as higher gearing for faster speeds both in the transfer case?

[lump_a_charcoal]

Maybe add some PSI...

[shep]

every sierra needs the gearing changed. there are plenty of options.
most of the people i wheel with have standard gearing and 30's while i have
6.5 trans gears and 31's. they have to hit most things fast and hard to
get through it, i just idle through the same stuff. gearing makes a crap driver good.

[Scrawny]

shep wrote:

gearing makes a crap driver good.

So there's hope for me yet

[shep]

ScrawnC wrote:

shep wrote:

gearing makes a crap driver good.

So there's hope for me yet

gearing + lockers make a crap driver awesome.

[shep]

nah i am just crap

[Saam]

this thread just got so much better

[shep]

boobies make stuff great.

[jonno_racing]

especially abbeys! even though its fake

[Gwagensteve]

There's another problem with diesels that hasn't been mentioned here, and that's powerband and how it compromises gearing options.

A stock sierra runs at about 3500rpm @ 100kph.

Any diesel isn't going to be happy with this - ideally, and assuming it's an adequately powerful diesel, you'd want maybe 2500-2700rpm @ 100.

There's no real way of achieving this with sensible diff gears and a sierra transfer case. to give you an idea, to achieve 2500 of road cruise with a stock sierra transfer and diff gears will take a 37" tyre - and the stock crawl ratio will suck with 37's regardless of whether you have a diesel or a petrol.

Generally, you're giving up 2000rpm of powerband swapping to a diesel, so your getting 30% less out of each gear. Sure, torque can compensate to allow you into a taller gear - so long as you have a taller gear available, which, if you have anything like stock sierra gearing, you won't.

To the torque thing - it's easy to look at modern, common rail turbodiesels and think 300Nm will solve any problem, but they are all going to be amazingly complex to swap in. (they are also packed with electronics much more sophisticated than an EFI petrol engine) Most of the plausible engines you could choose from will have less than 200Nm of torque.

Lets use the 3L (2.8 hilux) diesel as an example, and compare it to a g16B EFI motor.

They both make the same power (65Kw)
The Diesel makes 180Nm @ 2400rpm
The petrol makes 130Nm @ 3500rpm

One is a simple swap, is well geared with crawler gears, easy to keep cool, and can be fitted with 3 speed or 4 speed automatics, or sierra or vitara manuals, and the other is 100% "out on your own" in regard to cooling, GVM (and especially front axle load) gearing....

Really the only way to get a 3L in comfortably will be with a hilux transfer case meaning a centred rear diff, and ideally an extended wheelbase. It's hard to imagine after all that work, the diesel being significantly better to drive than a G16B EFI, or significantly better than a hilux with that motor in it.

Often people cite the "simplicity" of a diesel over an EFI petrol as a reason to do a swap. I disagree. They are simple to hook up, and run for a long time, but diesel fuel pumps are mightily complex, and a feasible donor engine is probably going to be looking for a fuel pump rebuild in the near future.

Just some thoughts.

Steve.

[beef13]

cheers Gwagensteve, dats great info, sure does help.
after i started the topic i started thinkin about all the extra bits i'd have to buy and figured it probably wasn't worth it anyway.

[bazook]

this place does the conversion if you really want to go that way
http://www.acmeadapters.com/

there was a video of a suzi with vw motor and runing vege oil but couldnt find it

[gusbus]

some yanks are even putting vw 1.9 tdi into luxs,and yes there is a conversion kit from us for vw tdi into sierra have just seen on ebay an 05 model tdi 2 litre golf engine and 6 speed box for 1300 bucks am toying with the idea also

[gusbus]

would it be legal though??

[Mick70b]

A guy over here used to run a 1.8 litre Gemini (Isuzu) deisel in his sierra?

[Gwagensteve]

Mick70b wrote:

A guy over here used to run a 1.8 litre Gemini (Isuzu) deisel in his sierra?

We had a clubmember that ran a couple of Gemini 1.8's in his sierra. It was quite good, (Better than I would have expected) but working with tired old motors and problematic highway gearing meant a G13 ended up back in it.

We had another car in the club years ago that had been built with a 1.8 Isuzu but by the time it made its way to the club... sure enough, a G13 was back in it.

Steve.

As for Americans putting VW 1.9's in Hiluxes - that doesn't surprise me. They also try to put OM617 Merc diesels in everything that moves, and whilst they are a smooth, high revving diesel, they mke the same power as a 2.8 hilux.

The US market has only had a couple of small diesels available over the last 25 years. You guessed it - the VW TDI and the OM617.